Read the November 1 meeting.

I would be afraid, but I don't even know how to do it. Yeah, I have no idea how to do it. Can you make me out of the theater? Oh, my. Want me to call the microphone? I think it's a little bit. Okay. Test one, two, three. Test.

I can hear you clearly. Can you hear me? I can hear you. Can you hear me? Yes, you sound clear. Can you try one or two more mics, please? Yep.

Test one, two, three, test. You sound great. Okay, great. I'll do one more. Thank you.

Test one, two, three, test. You sound good. Thank you very much. All right, thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Oh, maybe I'll be back.

Thank you.

Okay.

OK. OK.

Can I get mindனனனனனனனனனனனனன

Thank you.

Okay.

னனனன

! !

ன

ன னனனன னன ன

னனனனன

! ! ன

ன

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

னனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனன

Thank you.

னனனனனனனன ன

ன

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

னனனனனனனன ன ன ன ன ன ன ன

ன னனனனனன ! ! ன ன ன

ன

ன

Let's get started.

Let's get started.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

I love you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Phil Bacerra

It says standby still.

Phil Bacerra

All right. Well, look, let me go ahead and call this meeting to order. This is the special closed session meeting for the Santa Ana City Council for November 1, 2022. Welcome to November. Let me go ahead and make some opening remarks. This meeting is taking place with in-person attendance by teleconference via Zoom. The public can access the meeting via the Santa Ana YouTube channel or the city's website. And as always, please bear with us as the technology may disrupt the flow of the meeting. I'll go ahead and call on the clerk staff to call roll, please.

Councilmember Hernandez? Councilmember Lopez? Councilmember Mendoza? Councilmember Peñalosa? Present. Councilmember Fan? Mayor Pro Tem Becerra? Mayor Sarmiento?

Phil Bacerra

Here. And let me go ahead and ask if any members of the council wish to abstain from any items on the closed session agenda?

Phil Bacerra

Hearing none and seeing none, I'm going to toss it back to the clerk so she can make some remarks for anybody that may be online. Or do we have anybody online at this point?

We do not have anybody. Do not?

Phil Bacerra

Okay. Why don't we go ahead and recess in a closed session and we'll reconvene when we're done. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

னனனனனனனனன னனனன னனன

ன Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

னனனனனன

! ! ன ன ன ன ன ன ன

ன

ன ன ன

Let's get started.

னனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனன

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

னனனனனனனன னனன னனன னன ன

ன

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

னனனனனனனன

Let's get started.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

I love you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

னனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனன

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm

Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm Umm

னனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனன

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Let's get started.

Thank you.

னனனனனனனன ன னனனனனனனன ! ன ன ன

ன

ன

னனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனன

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

I love you

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

னனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனன

னனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனன

Transcription by CastingWords

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Let's get started.

Thank you.

னனனனனனனன ன

னனனனனனனனனனன ! ன ன ன

ன

ன

னனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனன

Let's get started.

Thank you.

Thank you.

னனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனன Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

னனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனன

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

னனனனனனனன ! ன ன

ன Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Let's get started.

Thank you.

னனனனனனன

! ! ன ன ன ன ன

ன

ன ன ன

னனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனன

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Let's get started.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Let's get started.

Let's get started.

Thank you.

னனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனன Thank you.

Amen.

Thank you.

னனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனனன Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

னனன ன ன

Thai Viet Phan

ன

Phil Bacerra

ன ன ன ன ன

!

!

!

!

Phil Bacerra

ன It is November 1st, 2022, and I want to welcome you all here, and we have the rare pleasure of being able to begin on time. So that is something that we're all very grateful for. Let me go ahead and make a few opening remarks as we start tonight's meeting. The meeting is taking place with in-person attendance and by teleconference via Zoom. The public can access the meeting via the Santa Ana YouTube channel or the city's website. and as usual, please bear with us as the technology may interrupt the flow of the meeting. I'm now going to call on the clerk staff to call the role of the council.

Council Member Hernandez.

Council Member Lopez. Here. Council Member Mendoza. Present. Council Member Peñalosa.

David Penaloza

Present.

Council Member Fan. Here. Mayor Pro Tempecerra.

Phil Bacerra

Here.

Mayor Sarmiento.

Phil Bacerra

Here. And before I call on Councilmember Peñalosa to lead us in the Pledge of Allegiance, I'm going to turn it back over to the clerk so she can make her opening remarks tonight.

To request to speak on agenda or non-agenda items within the city's jurisdiction, please dial star 9 from your phone or click the button labeled Raise Hand from Zoom at this time. Please announce your name and ward or neighborhood you reside in within the city of Santa Ana for the record.

Phil Bacerra

And as we rise to Pledge of Allegiance to the flag and have Councilmember Peñalosa lead us in that, I would like you all to remain standing. We're going to have our words of inspiration from Father Baderian, who is joining us tonight from the Forty Martyrs Church, one of the largest Armenian churches in Orange County, and we're blessed to have them here in Santa Ana. So if we all will please rise.

David Penaloza

If you could all please face our flag and put your right hand over your heart and follow along. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Phil Bacerra

Please, Father.

Thank you, dear mayor. Thank you, members of city council. it is a great privilege and honor for me to stand here and to do the invocation, the city where the Orange County Armenian Church, School, and Community Center are located. Let us pray. Lord our God, gracious, loving, and caring Father, as we are gathered here tonight, we ask for your wisdom and guidance. We pray for our country and our beloved city of Santa Ana. May you continue to bless our beloved mayor and his family, council members and their families,

and lead us all to do your will in this world. Give us wisdom and courage to always do the right thing without fear or hesitation, because you are our righteous God. Help us, Lord, to accept all without prejudice. In this country, we are blessed to celebrate our diversities and practice tolerance and acceptance. Help us to serve first the least, the lost, the poor, the vulnerable, and all those who are cast out among us. Lord our God, protect us from all the dangers and evil works.

Keep safe our children, schools, communities, and families. Let the harm, violence, crime and danger be away from our world.

May the hard work and dedication of our Mayor and City Council members and all public servants always be blessed. Great God, be with us now in the fullness of life, filling us with purpose and hope. We ask you to continue to bless our country, our city and the leadership because you are the Lord who gives wisdom and to his befitting power and glory forever. Amen. Thank you.

Phil Bacerra

Thank you, Father Bedourian. Thank you for those words of inspiration. I'm going to ask now somebody very special to come up and join me here. And I think in the court, they call it the well, But for us, we just call it the area behind the podium and in between the dais. So if I could have retired Judge Lynn Riddle come join me up here, please.

Phil BacerraItem 1

So tonight is a very special night and I have the honor of recognizing somebody that is not only very important to us in Santa Ana, on the federal bankruptcy bench, but somebody who I consider now a friend. I've known retired Judge Riddle now for many, many years. I began my career as a young lawyer appearing before her. She was one of the first federal district court judges that I appeared before. When I was a new lawyer, I was very nervous because if any of you have gone into federal court, it is a very intimidating environment.

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And Judge Riddle made it so painless, I guess, and so welcoming because she knew She had somebody that was just starting their career and just beginning in the practice of law. And so I wanted to recognize her not only for that, just her generosity, her calmness, her civility, and her presence when bringing somebody on as an officer of the court, but more importantly a lot of the work that she did before she went to the bench, all the great work she did while she was a federal bankruptcy court judge and the work she's doing now as a retired

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judge. I'll let her go into some of that detail because I won't do it justice, but I guess I want you all to know about her story because she has such close connections to Santa Ana and a lot of the work that she's done has helped, you know, improve the conditions of people's lives, not only those that have come before her when she was in court and sitting on the bench. And she was practicing, and she was also probably at that time one of the few federal bankruptcy court judges that was a woman. Back then, it was very different. It was a different time. So she was a trailblazer in her own right.

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And judges had tremendous, and continue to have tremendous power and authority. and she was so judicious with the way she had made her decisions. I was witness to it, and I'm very grateful that I was able to begin my practice in her courtroom. So let me tell you a little bit about the Honorable Judge Lynn Riddle. She was a federal judge from, let me put these on because I've aged since I was a young lawyer, so let me make sure I read these correctly. She was a federal judge from 1988 to 2002 and has been a social justice advocate throughout her whole life.

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In 1988, she was appointed by the judges of the United States Courts of Appeal to a 14-year term as a U.S. bankruptcy judge for the Central District of California that encompassed Los Angeles, Orange County, San Bernardino, Riverside, Santa Barbara, Ventura, and San Luis Obispo counties. Prior to being a judge, she taught philosophy for 10 years and worked with the office of the president of the University of California, Berkeley as a woman's advocate in their Affirmative Action Unit. The Honorable Judge Lynn Riddle understood that women and people of color did not have

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any teaching opportunities, and even when given the opportunity, they were short-lived. She entered her third year of law school and frustrated by the lack of professor diversity in her law school's 100 years, only two women professors who had short-term positions. She then sued UC Hastings Law. When she graduated from law school, six women were hired to serve as professors, including Mary Kay Kane, who became the first woman dean at UC Hastings Law. And that's actually where my sister got her degree, from Hastings. So that's right in the heart of San Francisco, if those of you don't know.

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but it's one of the best law schools in the country. The Honorable Judge Lynn Riddle is a social justice advocate in Santa Ana and Orange County. She is a long-term, long-time board member for Planned Parenthood of Orange and San Bernardino County's Community Action Fund. She is a community leader who encourages civic participation in the community. She's an educational advocate who pushes for a more diverse curriculum in the public education system, including Santa Ana, Udphite School District. She's fighting for reproductive rights, educational equity, women's rights, and workers' rights.

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Santa Ana has a very special place in Judge Riddle's heart. As a judge, she also learned the stories and struggles of many Santa Ana residents. So I want to thank you for, you know, giving us the opportunity to honor somebody who has worked as a public servant, literally, to make the conditions of residents in Santa Ana, residents in Orange County better. I think the judge as she wound down her career she didn't take retirement as the literal sense to just do nothing she continued serving the public. But you know Judge Riddle I just wanted to thank you for your years of

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service on the bench, thank you for your years of advocacy before coming to the bench and all the good work that you've been doing since. But please if you'll share with us a few words and please give a big round of applause to Judge Lynn Riddle.

Thank you so much for having me and thank you mayor and thank you to the board members that I have council members that I've just recently met. Again thank you for having me I'll be very brief witness with this but I've always considered the city of Santa Ana to be the very heart of Orange County I think it is the heart and soul I when I had been a teacher across the country a professor for 10 years before I became a lawyer but when I opened my first law office it was in

Santa Ana, South Santa Ana on Dyer Road as a matter of fact. And I practiced there for quite a while and then I decided to move uptown and I moved to Ettinger. So I just had small businesses in the in that area that I served. But I have always found myself deeply attached and loved and loving towards this community. And that's why it's so important and so meaningful to me to have you have me here this evening because I hope that I can remain, that I

have been accepted and that I can remain a member of the Santa Ana family. Thank you so much for this honor. I'm pleased, pleased to be here. Thank you.

Phil BacerraItem 1

Judge, Judge, where are you going? Don't leave yet. I need you to stay with me. I need to give you the proclamation. Oh, I get to be proclaimed as well. You get to be proclaimed as well. So I'm just going to read a few of the whereas clauses because I think you are much too modest in describing your experience. But for nine years prior to law school, Judge Riddle was a graduate and, as I said, a professor in training at Syracuse University, Cal State Long Beach, and the State University at Iowa, UC Santa Barbara, and Dalhousie University in Halifax, Nova Scotia.

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I also want to let you know that Judge Riddle's father owned a business in Santa Ana, and in her youth, she would assist her father prior to and after law school. This is where she learned the stories of the struggles of Santa Ana residents, and it is why Santa Ana, she will always hold Santa Ana as a very special place in her heart. So today we want to proclaim honoring the work that Judge Riddle's done, and hopefully she'll serve it as an example to many young women, many women who are following a path not just in law, but in advocacy. So Judge Riddle, I couldn't think of a better person to endow this with, and it comes with

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a lot of gratitude on behalf of all the residents in Santa Ana to you hopefully you'll keep this in a special place for you as a memory of our recognition team thank you so much

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So let me call now on Council Member Lopez who is going to be doing the next. Is it your presentation, Council Member?

Jessie LopezItem 1

I'm trying to figure out if Mitzi is here.

Phil BacerraItem 1

Okay. Let's go ahead and do that one next.

Phil BacerraItem 1

Let me go ahead and call on Councilmember Mendoza for the next presentation.

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And if we could have Celica Diaz, Celica are you here? Come on up here and join us.

Good evening, residents, guests, honored guests, city staff, and of course our community leader, Celica Diaz.

So, Celica is from the Pacific Park neighborhood, and since the time I met her, I've seen a very dynamic, involved, unselfish, dedicated, hardworking person. Well, that was me I was describing. Just kidding. Just kidding. Just kidding. It was her. I see a person who is just so much involved in her community and she does it with a loving heart and very in an effort to bring the community together.

So Celica is a proud resident of the City of Santa Ana and has been involved in her community for almost two decades. That's 20 years. In 2003, Celica planned and coordinated a community resource fair at Pacific Park, formerly known as Eastside. And coincidentally, that was where I was living. That's where I bought my first home in Eastside in 1986. In 2009, she attended a city council meeting and proposed that a new park be built on the corner of Orange and McFadden. This action resulted in the formation of Santa Ana Healthy Neighborhood Alliance,

which is composed of resident leaders from surrounding neighborhoods. After nine years of advocacy, the Alliance succeeded and celebrated a ribbon-cutting of the Pacific Electric Park. In 2016, Celica began to advocate to save and preserve the Cypress Street Fire Station with the help of other community members, the Alliance successfully brought the PAL program to the Cypress Street Fire Station. And I'm very proud of that, especially Celica.

Celica also helped to reactivate the neighborhood association meetings in the Police Athletic and Activities League. She has been instrumental in helping connect hard to reach residents from Santa Ana Cares and revived Santa Ana resources. Celica's commitment, enthusiasm, and passion to serve her community has brought stability to the quality of life for many residents. It is an honor and a true honor to recognize her for her outstanding contributions to the Santa Ana community on this day, the first day of November of 2022,

2022, and hopefully in this day, 1st November of 2026, we may have Councilmember Salica Diaz.

So I'm very proud to give this to you.

Thank you so much.

A few words, please.

For me, it's a true honor to receive this certificate. And mainly I want to thank my husband and my kids, because without them I wouldn't be able to accomplish all the things that I accomplished. They are my number one volunteers. As many times I tell them, you guys are my valentoles. To do as I say, and we volunteer from beginning to end. When we show up, we make sure it's clean, and when we leave, we make sure it's cleaner. I also want to thank the community for giving me the opportunity to give back. I want to thank the city staff for being so supportive when I say we need to plan a community event.

It's not easy, but it gives me such joy to see the people come out and take advantage of all the resources that are available to them. And at times those resources get lost because nobody uses them. So I truly believe that in order for resources to be used, we got to bring them to the community. What else can I say? Thank you, Nelida. Thank you, council members and mayor and city staff. My heart, it's in the community, but my heart is with my husband and my kids, because without them, I wouldn't be able to do what I do today for the city. Thank you.

Would her husband and son and children please come up? We're going to take some photos. We're going to show that this really did happen. Yes, photos are definitely the preservation of beautiful memories for our families, our community, here in chambers.

So who do we have here? What's your name? Itzy Diaz, Jaden, Juby, and Juby. Juby to the second power, right? So this is the Diaz family. Would you please give them a big round of applause?

Okay, me next. More?

We're actually missing one more member that is subtracted right now. Really?

Oh, my goodness.

Wow.

Thank you. Thank you for sharing your mantra. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Phil BacerraItem 1

Thank you for that, Councilmember, and congratulations, Salica, and your family. Let me go ahead and call on Councilmember Peña-Losa, who is going to be recognizing La Chiquita Restaurant for their 30 years.

Want to bring up the whole family, Sammy? Feel free.

David PenalozaItem 1

Whoever wants to join. granddaughter Erin, Mrs. Montoya.

David PenalozaItem 1

I'm just kind of disappointed you didn't cater the meeting today.

It's outside.

David PenalozaItem 1

Yeah, after. Burritos for the after party. Yes, enchiladas. Oh, enchiladas. So good evening everyone. Tonight I'd like to recognize, I wait till the family comes up here, like to recognize not only Sammy Montoya but his family as well on their 30th anniversary as the owner of La Chiquita restaurant. La Chiquita was founded actually over 70 years ago. This month though marks 30 years of Sammy being the owner of the slogan neighborhood gem. In 1982 Sammy's American dream began when he and his brothers immigrated to the US from Zacatecas, Mexico, settling in Laguna

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beach and working at the well-known White House restaurant. As he worked his way up the restaurant, Sammy made numerous connections that turned into lifelong customers and friends. In 1994, one of the loyal customers from both the White House and La Chiquita approached Sammy about the possible closing of La Chiquita in Santa Ana. In an effort to keep his neighborhood, this neighborhood staple open, customers who then turned into investors agreed to support Sammy in becoming the owner of the restaurant. Within 10 years, he paid off all his debts to the investors.

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He then became the owner of three additional properties next to the restaurant, La Chiquita Market, the tortilla factory, and a home all located on the same block. Here we are 30 years later in La Chiquita, the second oldest Mexican restaurant in Santa Ana. Sammy has remained true to their old school atmosphere, with pictures of five generations' worth of customers on the wall, their large taco salads, steamy chile verde, and gigantic burritos. La Chiquita is a staple for Santa Ana residents and visitors nationwide, but especially for those in the historic Logan Barrio. When asked what makes this restaurant special,

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Sammy says that the love the people feel for this place and the memories. The food is good, but the memories are what is most important. On behalf of the City of Santa Ana and our City Council, so I'd like to congratulate La Chiquita owner, Sammy Montoya and his family for their 30th anniversary. Thank you for serving our community and providing great food and memories for all who walked through the doors at La Chiquita restaurant. Now, I've known the Montoya family for over 20 years. I actually went to school with your daughter Geraldine, and she's not here tonight. So Geraldine, if you're watching this,

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You owe me lunch a la chiquita.

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So we would be, during summer school, ending class at 12, and all of us would always be kind of like hanging out after school, and she'd be like, oh, I gotta go to work. Like, where do you work? You're 14, 15 years old. Child labor laws, I'm sorry. I'm outing you here. Yeah, throwing you under the bus. And she said, oh, I work at my dad's restaurant. And I'm like, oh, where's this at? I had no idea you know where this restaurant was at but she would go to work you know and and so that was a kind of telling of what you've done as the foundation to your family of work ethics and and a family-run business which is

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amazing so thank you and the great food by the way so if you guys are ever in that part of town please have food I know we've gone with city manager a couple of times with members of the staff and neighborhood leaders there so So with La Chiquita Restaurant, I'd like to give you this recognition to you and your family. And if you want to say a couple words, if you want to say them in English, Spanish, feel free.

Thank you. Thank you so much.

Thank you. Thank you. Well, first of all, I want to thank my family.

Without my family, I wouldn't have anything. We have two kids and now the grandkids. Thank you for all the support. All those days that I'm never home, you know, I'm always working almost 24 hours. So thank you to my wife. She supports us all these years. without the family. My daughter, she's working today, so she's not here, but we have my son, and now we have my granddaughter.

And Santana, it's been the best for me. I bought the first house in 1987. Both of my kids were born there and grew up there, and they went to Cal State Fullerton. So Santana can give it back to you. And here we are.

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And Sammy is also owner of the Green Parrot Villa on Main Street. So for those that are looking for a Sunday brunch or Taco Tuesday, right?

Right now, it's just Sunday brunch.

David PenalozaItem 1

Sunday brunch. Sunday brunch. Green Parrot Villa.

Somebody that's planning a wedding.

David PenalozaItem 1

Yes, or weddings, or that just keeps coming up. Yeah. But yeah.

So thank you. Thank you to your family. Thank you so much. Thank you.

Phil BacerraItem 1

Thank you, Councilmember. Let's give them all a big round of applause.

Phil BacerraItem 2

So I know we had another recognition by Councilmember Lopez to Mitzi Abasto and I think she probably realized or she probably expected us to come out much later as we normally do so. Councilmember would you like to go ahead and maybe put this over to the next meeting or? That's fine. Do that so So, alrighty, well, we'll make sure we have her back and we, and hopefully we'll start again on time. So that is the end of our presentations for the evening. Let me go ahead and go to the regular closed session report and I'm going to ask the city attorney if there's anything that she is going to report at a closed session.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 2

Mayor, members of the council and members of the public, we had several closed session items this evening, but we do not have any reportable action.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Thank you for that. let me go ahead and bring us to the public comment section of the meeting and I'll go ahead and say that this is a time and place for the City Council to receive comments from the public on agendized and non-agendized items pursuant to the Brown Act the City Council may not enter in any discussion with anybody we will simply take comments from everybody and know that there is a three minute limit you don't have to give us your specific or the specific home address but let us know if you reside in the city what ward that is

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and I'll go ahead and ask the clerk staff if they have anybody that is in the queue for any phone calls or any remote comments.

Speakers on the queue may provide their comments on agenda or non-agenda items within the city's jurisdiction. When unmuted, please announce your name, ward, or neighborhood that you reside in within the city of Santa Ana for the record.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Great, thank you. Let me go ahead and what I'll do is I'll call on people who are here physically present, then I'll turn it over to the clerk staff so she can call on those that are waiting online. Let me begin with Frank Mitchell followed by Ulmaro Vicente followed by Adam Overton.

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Welcome, sir.

Good evening, Mayor. Good evening, people of the City Council of the City of Santa Ana. I'm Frank Mitchell III. I'm gonna be brief I've got to be brief okay because I talk way too much so let me get back to the point I'm here to discuss an error in section 41 dash

194.3 development standards that have been approved by the city of Santa Ana This has to do with accessory dwelling units standards. Accessory dwelling units, which is an accessory dwelling unit built on the property of a primary unit for rental or for other family members. It's a very good ordinance. All of you have done a good job on the research. and study on this, but there is a serious error.

The city of Santa Ana allows homeowners to build accessory dwelling units, and if they have a two-story residence, the city of Santa Ana allows them to build a two-story accessory dwelling unit. That's where the error is. I have given you copies of my letters so this could speed things up. Now, the big area is the construction of a two-story accessory dwelling unit. It says it can't be higher than 16 feet. The primary residence can be as high as 35 feet, two-story.

16 feet, you can't have a two-story accessory dwelling unit. Eight-foot high ceilings on the ground floor, which could be a garage or another unit. Then there's 12 inches, which composes the floor joists, ceiling joists, and the wood subfloor. Then you have another 8 feet on top of that. That's 17 feet right there, and we haven't even reached the ceiling. And, of course, the roof as well. That's a serious error, and it harms homeowners who would like to build a second-story accessory drawing unit,

especially if they have limited land area for rear yard open space. So I'm urging you to rectify this and correct this as soon as possible. Any questions?

Phil BacerraItem 2

We can't do a question and answer. Oh, that's fine. But before you leave the Director of Planning, Min Tai will go ahead and take your information down and follow up with you. I believe you're in Ward 1, so Council Member Fan will also follow up with you.

Okay, and of course you have copies of my letter too. Thank you, Frank.

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and thank you. Have a good evening. You too. Next speaker is Bulmaro Vicente followed by Adam Overton followed by Jairo Cortes. Hello Mayor and Council my

name is Bulmaro Bulmaro Vicente. I'm the policy director for CHISPA. First I just want to thank the majority of the council and city staff for accepting our previous amendments and for meeting with community members to discuss this important issue of police oversight. As representatives of the city it's important that community members feel heard and included in this process. With the first ordinance being presented, CHISPA and the ACLU sent a letter to the Council and City staff detailing some amendments we want to clarify on the scope and power of the Commission. We hope that the Council can move forward

passing these amendments. Some that I want to highlight include making clear under the establishment and purpose of the Commission to clarify that the Commission has a duty to, through the independent director, to conduct independent community-led investigations and deliver recommendations. Second, the ordinance must clarify that current peace officers or their immediate family members are not eligible to serve under Commission. We must ensure that this Commission is civilian-led and there is not influence from current law enforcement. Next, we highly disagree with the record check requirement of commissioners.

Record checks are unnecessary deterrent for commissioners who would already be mandated to sign a confidential agreement. This provision also further criminalizes people with former convictions who can serve on the board. Furthermore, this is not a requirement for any other city commissions including the Personnel Board. We also ask that the police department should only be attending meetings as requested by the Commission. We've seen how police officers and other commissions dominate meetings and can often intimidate members of the public from discussing important issues relating to police oversight. We hope

Hope this mirrors how council requests a police department to answer any policies or questions that they may have during these meetings. Our last priority amendments include making clear the subpoena power of the commission, developing a clear process for disciplinary recommendations, making the commission reports records public, and striking the provision that limits the commission's duties which is subject to SAPD policies and procedures. This vague reference to SAPD policies and procedures has the potential to obstruct the duties of the commission.

We must ensure that no future policy created by SAPD can hinder oversight at this commission. We hope you consider these amendments and pass them to create meaningful police oversight in the city of Santana. Thank you.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Thank you. Adam Overton, followed by Jairo Cortez, followed by Carol Mendez.

Good evening, Mayor. City Councilors, City Staff. My name's Adam Overton, and I'm a faith-rooted organizer with CLU, Clergy and Lady United for Economic Justice in Orange County. CLU seeks to educate, organize, and mobilize the faith community while we accompany workers and their families in their struggle for good jobs, dignity, and justice. We're here today to speak in support of Item Number 15, to adopt an ordinance establishing a police review commission. We commend the city council and city staff for working so seriously and diligently to create and pass this police oversight ordinance.

At the last council meeting, we arrived concerned that some of the policy language profoundly differed from the model policy that was discussed back in July at city council. But we were heartened by the thoughtful conversation that followed between city council and city staff. That said, we continue to urge the council to approve the creation of a police oversight commission today that adheres to the one supported and written by ACLU and community-based organizations. In 2016 CLU's Black Jewish Justice Alliance, a coalition of rabbis and black pastors from the Southern Christian

Leadership Committee and Convention in Los Angeles, was an instrumental partner in pushing for the creation of the Los Angeles County Civilian Oversight Commission. Since then, we've seen both how such a commission can succeed and how such a commission can fail. We learned firsthand that for oversight to be truly effective and gain the public's confidence, such a commission needs to have the teeth to review cases and make recommendations. Effective police oversight is clearly long overdue, And we thank you again for engaging so seriously with what Santa Ana residents have been calling for for over 60 years.

And we urge you again today, tonight, to adopt the ACLU and CHISPA's amendments to the draft police oversight ordinance. Thank you so much.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Thank you, Adam.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Jairo Cortes followed by Caro Mendez followed by Ronaldo Villeda.

Good evening, Mr. Mayor and members of the council. I'm Jairo Cortes, I'm the Executive Director at Chispa. And I don't really prepare anything, and I'm going to keep it very brief. First of all, we want to thank all of you for the discussion and the conversation at the council meeting two weeks ago. We had a very substantial, very important conversation about what effective police oversight should and could look like in Santana.

And so we are very, you know, I think like Adam mentioned, we were heartened by the substance of the conversation, by the depth of changes that were made to the language that had been shared in the staff report at the time. And I think like what today, what we're asking for is really like, let's get this done. It's been 57 years since police oversight was first proposed in Santana and tonight is our opportunity as a city to make history and to deliver on this promise of 57 years. And as my colleagues have shared and as some of my other colleagues will share, what we've

shared in one of our letters in this past week, we really just want to clarify some of the scopes of the powers, make just clarifications on what the Oversight Commission will do, just so that the language that we end up with is as clear as possible, and so that we end up with something that's truly reflective of the type of process that this council really has endeavored in over the last two years as we've moved forward. So thank you. I hope everybody has a great evening. And we urge you to vote yes on this ordinance.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Thank you for those comments. Carol Mendez followed by Ronaldo Villeda followed by Kelly Crouse Lee.

Good evening. My name is Carolina Mendez and I've been a member of CHISPA for two years. I'm here tonight to speak in support of the work that's being done on this council to create a strong, robust police oversight commission and to ask that you consider adopting the proposed amendments raised by both Chispa and the ACLU. Like Jairo shared, Santana residents have been engaged in this fight for the creation of a strong commission for 60 long years. And this struggle is motivated primarily by a desire, right, for accountability and transparency, which so many of our black and brown communities have been deprived of,

not just in the city, but across the nation when it comes to the way our neighborhoods are policed. If we achieve this win in Santana tonight and demonstrate that effective community-informed police oversight is possible, it will undoubtedly compel other cities to follow suit. We commend and thank the council and city staff for making it a priority to incorporate key elements of the community's direction in the creation of this ordinance. And we urge the following considerations and make a few recommendations tonight. First, the inclusion of language that specifically promotes investigative authority.

This edit, while small, would ensure that the Commission holds not only the power to audit, but to actively exercise investigative authority into police practices, officer-involved shootings, and other forms of misconduct. Clarity and language is absolutely necessary and essential. Second, that current police officers are not eligible for Commission membership, as we seek a commission composed entirely of civilians. Extending that further, like my colleagues have shared, we ask for the removal of record checks as they pose an unnecessary deterrent. If no other city commission

requires one, this one shouldn't either. It's just an uncalled-for barrier. Lastly, it's essential that the police chief's participation in meetings doesn't undermine the Commission's work. As such, we ask that their participation be at the sole discretion of the Commission in order to avoid any potential power imbalances that may be imposed. To close, thank you again truly for all of your commitment to building an effective police oversight model that puts on but then our residents and our community members first. Very grateful to the countless people who have spoken in support of this agenda item, whether in person or at home,

and to the organizations, organizers, activists, and community members who are currently leading this critical effort. We have an opportunity to make history tonight, and we strongly encourage you to remember that. Thank you for your time.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Thank you for those comments, Carolina. Ronaldo Villera, followed by Kelly Kraus-Lee, followed by Victor Mendez.

Hello, council members and mayor. Thank you for your time and the opportunity to make a comment on this historic ordinance today. My name is Ronaldo Villeda and today I come to you as a community organizer and advocate. I'm in full support of police oversight commission. However, I urge you all extreme caution when analyzing the foundational building blocks, which are at our disposal to create meaningful oversight and accountability. In order for this body to be robust, it requires the participation of community members who have been impacted by the very issues we are attempting to remedy.

We must have a minimum of one formerly incarcerated individual, one person who has directly been impacted by police brutality, and a family member of a victim as well. The cliche, those closest to the problem have the solutions, rings true in this situation. We must humanize and create seats at the table intentionally if we are to have the meaningful dialogues and discussions needed to create a body with formidable force and accountability for our community. Having law enforcement presence on this body can deter meaningful accountability and create an environment which is not conducive to meaningful change within the department.

I have seen this occur at the state and county levels firsthand. The continued need and outcry from our communities must be heard. We have waited almost 60 years to finally cross into a threshold. Previous leadership was either afraid or completely indifferent to explore. I commend you as a body for taking this stance, but please heed the comments heard today from our community members and key stakeholders who have continuously advocated to make this a reality. Oversight without a backbone is no oversight at all. Give our community members the tools, resources, and powers they deserve to create meaningful accountability.

Anything less will be detrimental to our collective goals and only continue to perpetuate the trauma we aim to stop. Thank you.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Thank you. Kelly Krause-Lee.

Kelly Crouse- Good evening. My name is Kelly Crouse-Lee and I live in Ward 6. I'm here tonight in support of item 14, the resolution regarding the cold weather shelter and also in support of the Police Oversight Commission, item 15. I won't belabor the point on police oversight except to voice support for the amendments proposed by CHISPA and ACLU. However, regarding item 14, first I want to say thank you to the council and the city staff and the city attorney for standing up to the county on our behalf. I know you mostly hear from us when we're really angry, so I just want to say thank you.

I also want to inform all of you, as well as the larger public, about a conversation I had today with Supervisor Foley about the cold weather shelter. When I asked Supervisor Foley why the county was opening yet another shelter in Santa Ana, she hid behind Judge Walker's decision and said she has no power over this. When I suggested that next year the county could look to other cities to open the shelter, she claimed that the vast majority of the homeless people in the county are Santa Ana residents. I pointed out to her that maybe people are claiming residency here because we are the only city for many years

that has provided any sort of service or shelter, and she had no response to that. Then I looked up the point-in-time count from February. Of the 5,718 unhoused individuals in Orange County, only 17% were in Santa Ana. In line with the resolution being considered tonight, I urged her that South County needs to step up and share the county-wide responsibility of housing the unhoused. She had the audacity to claim that South County doesn't have an unhoused population. Her proof is that she walks the precincts down there for her campaign. Yet the point-in-time count reported 585 unhoused individuals in the South Spa.

I bring all of this to you tonight so that as you continue to fight the county on our behalf, and I hope that you do, you are fully aware of who our allies are, and Supervisor Foley is not one of them. Thank you.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Thank you for those comments, Kelly. Let me call on Victor Mendez, followed by Bertha Ramirez, followed by Mary Jane de la Riva.

Good evening. A lot to cover. Mr. Mayor, again, we wish to thank you for your efforts to lower the rents for the senior citizens at 2222. I've gotten a ton of responses to my text. Thank you very, very much for that effort. And we look forward to your future successes. Last night, I was a victim of a potential home invasion attempt at my apartment. I don't know who this individual was. He didn't identify himself. I called the police. It took an hour and a half to come out to my apartment. They finally woke me up about quarter to one. They didn't come out to see me. They just took some information. That was it.

Fortunately, nothing was wrong, but you can see we got a lot of issues over there. And that's the second attempt of my life while living here. I don't know what's going to happen with number three, but I don't intend to make it a number three. With respect to item 11, congratulations to the City Manager and her performance review, but I'd only remind you that the City Manager made an express commitment to help senior citizens with the revived funding on this current tranche, and we expect that to happen, and we're not going to let that one go.

Police Oversight Commission, I offer an alternative. I think the current structure of the ordinance is in relatively good shape. I have some very specific comments. I think in general the draft needs to be revised to reflect the independent and autonomous nature of the Commission, specifically around 2-665. Also any termination of the independent director should require a three-fifths recommendation of the Commission. Also, the Commission should be provided the authority to set its own budget subject to the City Manager's Review and City Council approval. You can't have somebody who's being overseen set the budget for the overseer.

That doesn't make any sense. I would like you to also add a condition which allows the Commission to contract for professional services through the City Manager using the City Manager as a contracting authority and the officer, but instituting the Commissioners as the client, much the same as you do with financial audits. I would also ask that the definition of the practices be expanded, and that's in 26652, expanded to include financial management and operational practices. This is a way we can gain better use of our resources and funds out of our police department.

Also, the independent director under 2-665G should also have risk-related oversight responsibilities, such as looking at loss trending, risk analysis, loss cause analysis, and trying to help reduce the incidence of loss and also lower our cost. That's an extraordinarily valuable exercise and one which we can do lessons learned. Thank you so much for these considerations. I'll leave you with a hard copy of my comments to the ordinance for your consideration. Thank you.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Thank you, Victor. Berta Ramirez followed by Mary Jane de la Riva.

I just want to thank you, Mayor, for doing that rental agreement for us, you know, to lower our rent. I live in 2222 East 1st Street, and I just want to thank you. It's a beginning for us, you know, as seniors that are finally retiring, you know. And I know we'll probably get a raise from Social Security, but that raise that we'll get, it'll go to the owner of the apartment, so it's like we don't get anything anyway. So I just want to thank you so much.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Thank you very much. Mary Jane De La Riva is our last in-person speaker.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Mary Jane, this is painless. It's painless?

Okay. Thank you very much. Take your time. I'm so nervous. I've never done this before. I don't do well at public speaking. But I know you. I've seen you before. You've come to our complex. So I feel comfortable with you. All right. Well, thank you for this. I'm going to read because I wrote it down, what I want to say. Thank you for this opportunity to express myself. I live at Metro East Senior Apartments in Santa Ana. I have lived there for two years. During my first year, they've increased our rent to 10%. The residents were outraged, and with the strong voice of our own resident, Victor Mendez, he got involved

with the Santa Ana City Council, and that's when Mayor Cerro Mento became aware of our situation. Long story short, Mayor Saramanto made a special visit to our complex this past Friday to inform us that our 10% rent increase will change and we are receiving a refund and the rent increase went down to 5%. So my main purpose for being here is to say thank you Mayor Vicente Saramanto for your support and compassion accepting our request to change the inappropriate rent increase.

You are a very kind person and you have my vote for OC supervisor. Thank you. I'm sorry, that's it.

Phil BacerraItem 2

You did great. Thank you.

And thank you for everyone too for listening. Thank you.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Thank you very much. So I wanted to take a break after our last speaker who was Mary Jane because we had our person who came for the presentation from Councilmember Lopez. So Mitzi Abbasso, if you don't mind coming up here and having the presentation bestowed on you, and you've got a sash and you're looking great, so come on up. And then, Madam Clerk, we'll go ahead and go back to those that are remote as soon as this presentation is done.

Jessie LopezItem 2

Okay, well we're taking a little break from public comment to recognize Mitzi Abasto, who I met when we were actually doing some community work through the Cambodian family earlier in 2021. And Mitzi comes from a family of Bolivian immigrants and since the age of two has been living in the city of Santa Ana and she's a proud alumni of UC Davis with a bachelor's degree in genetics and genomics and a minor in public health. And Mitzi is currently Miss Santa Ana

Jessie LopezItem 2

2022 and she will represent our city in the Miss California pageant next year in January of 2023. So yeah, go ahead.

Jessie LopezItem 2

And so part of that platform or part of that experience is that Mitzi gets to choose a platform or a cause or something to advocate for and she chose planting a seed of hope and the mayor is going to tell us more about planting a seed of hope.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Thank you, Councilmember, and thank you, Mitzi. And I know that normally we start really late because we go long on our closed session, and today we just happen to be very short. So we're way ahead of the curve we got ahead of you. So let me tell you a little bit about Planting a Seat of Hope. So it focuses on mental health awareness and education. As of now, Mitzi has spoken to youth and hosted a gardening workshop to promote mental health in our community. She currently works as a community advocate at a nonprofit in Santa Ana.

Phil BacerraItem 2

This job has opened up her perspective on regarding food and health disparities, victims of crime, domestic violence, and homelessness. She's had the opportunity to connect her clients to different resources and organizations to help them. And Mitzi realizes there is a lot of work to do and looks forward to continuing advocating for people here in Santa Ana. and it is really not often that we're able to recognize somebody who shares my experience. So Mitzi is a proud Bolivian-American, as am I, and we're very few in the community. So we're a very small percentage, but like we say, we're small but mighty.

Phil BacerraItem 2

And Mitzi certainly personifies that with the professional work that she does as an advocate. But more importantly, I know that she cares about her culture. And even though her experience and mine, you know, we were raised here, so we really don't have that lived experience that many people have as immigrants that come here. I came when I was a year old. But we still embrace it and we still cherish it through our parents, through our ancestors that make sure that we provide, you know, what's a beautiful, you know, texture and fabric to our community, bringing our own experiences here.

Phil BacerraItem 2

So I want to celebrate Mitzi and everything she's done. And I want to thank Councilmember Lopez for recognizing the important work that young people are doing To address the mental wellness of many of our youth We know we've gone through a very difficult time these past couple of years and the impact has been especially acute to many of our young people and we know that Sometimes peer-to-peer support is is really important. So Mitzi. We just wanted to celebrate you today. You look great congratulations on being Miss Santa Anna look we couldn't have anything better

Phil BacerraItem 2

so if you don't mind giving sharing a few words and please giving give a big round of applause to Mitzi Abbasin

hello everyone thank you so much for having me tonight thank you council members mayor I wouldn't be Miss Santa Anna if it wasn't for the love that I have for the city and my community members and for my culture. I mean Santa Anna I can't describe it. If you lived in Santa Anna you know it is I don't know what it is I just love Santa Anna. But growing up here it's definitely shaped me and once I got into the career that I am right now it made me realize that there's a lot of work to do in our community and what better work to do it

as Miss Santa Anna right so I wouldn't have imagined of being here and talking to you if it wasn't for councilmember Jesse Lopez I literally jumped out of my chair when I got that phone call and I'm just so excited to be here and to represent this wonderful city thank you so much and I hope to be a great impact to everyone in the community. Thank you so much. Thank you.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Council.

Before meeting callers, I would like to begin by reporting the following summary of emails provided as of today. One non-agenda comment from residency not disclosed requested the county open the animal shelter to increase adoptions. On item number 13, one Santa Ana resident requested council adopt permanent solution for remote teleconferencing. On item number 15, the first reading of the ordinance, establishing a police oversight commission, eight various organizations support amended ordinance as proposed by community-based organization. One Sanana resident supports establishing a commission that has power of subpoena and

disciplinary recommendation. And one Sanana resident provided various comments and suggestions on ordinance. Zoom ID, Sylvia, please select the microphone icon to unmute from your device and proceed with your comment. You have three minutes to speak. Thank you.

Good evening. My name is Sylvia Hernandez. I'm a longtime resident of the Eastside neighborhood here in Santa Ana. today i want to talk about the ordinance establishing on police review commission we the sanana residents have been calling on the city to create a police oversight commission since the 1960s 60 years now waiting for results it is time now to listen to the residents demands for accountability and transparency of the police department.

I urge you to adopt the ACLU and Chispas amendments to the draft police oversight ordinance. The police violence and misconduct have cost Sanana residents over 20 million in lawsuits and settlements over the last decade. Imagine all of that money. I can imagine all that money invested in my community, in my neighborhood, in programs that really care about our kids, our young people here, and not being harassed by the police.

I am in full support of a strong and robust police oversight commission to rain and abuses by Sanana police officers. they have been getting a lot of money but i don't feel safe here in my neighborhood again we really want this ordinance to ensure accountability and transparency to the residents so i urge you to adopt the vote yes and adopt the aclu and chispas amendment to the draft of police oversight ordinance. Thank you for listening.

Zoom ID, Benjamin, please select the microphone icon to unmute from your device and proceed with your comment. You have three minutes to speak.

Hello, my name is Benjamin Benjamin Vasquez. I live in Ward two in Hanninger Park. I'm a teacher at Valley High School. I'm here to talk and support the police accountability and we need something with teeth. The police officer association has held the city hostage as it even recalled a city council member. We had the POA president threaten to burn down the city if he didn't get his ways for his retirement fund. And the POA, the police officer association, has spent half a million dollars on this election.

They want to continue to do the same thing by giving each one of those members, not all of them, but the three, Nelida, David, and Phil, $100,000 for their campaigns. I am for police accountability, and I need to have investigative authority. We need subpoena powers and give recommendations. We need to remove the record checks and allow for the findings to meet the public. We need to be transparent. We need to know what is happening in our community. and we have to make sure that we support this with TEIC. Thank you.

Zoom ID, Tanya, please select the microphone icon to unmute from your device and proceed with your comment. You have three minutes to speak.

Hello, my name is Tanya Navarro, lifetime resident of Santana, and I'm calling today in support of agenda item number 15. Santana has the chance to leave tonight in the fight for truly effective police oversight. Police violence and misconduct have cost Santana residents over 20 million in lawsuit settlements over the last decade, and has caused deeply rooted generational harm and mistrust. Creating a commission that includes power imbalances, for example, having record checks or including officers or their family members, will only further add to the harm and mistrust that our communities already experience.

I'm in full support of strong and robust police oversight of a strong and robust police oversight commission to rein in abuses by Santa Ana police officers and ensure accountability and transparency to residents. I urge you to adopt the ACLU and Chispa's amendments to the draft of the police oversight ordinance. Lastly, thank you to the council for your robust conversations on this topic. I hope that you continue on this trajectory of listening to the community and putting our needs first by adopting truly effective of police oversight. Thank you. Zoom ID, Sean, please select the microphone icon

to unmute from your device and proceed with your comment. You have three minutes to speak.

Hello, council. I just wanted to urge the council tonight to adopt the ACLU and Chiefs Post's amendments to the draft police oversight ordinance. We need independent oversight, not the meme of we investigated ourselves and found that we did nothing wrong. To this end, the police oversight commission must be independent meaning no law enforcement employees on the board the board must include people most affected by over policing and police violence in Santa Ana and the board members must be selected through an independent selection panel process as currently written the draft

ordinance put together by city staff would create a review model similar to Anaheim's which as others have said is completely inadequate and insufficient I therefore urge you to adopt the ACLU and Chief's amendments to the draft police oversight ordinance thank you very much Final speaker, Zoom ID Amina, please select the microphone icon to unmute from your device and proceed with your comment. You have three minutes to speak. Good evening, Mayor Sarmiento and Council Members. My name is Amina Kazi. I'm the co-director of the Peace and Justice Law Center based in North Orange County.

I just want to echo what so many speakers have said tonight about supporting the creation of the police oversight commission with the amendments offered by the ACLU and Chiefs Peswell to ensure that the police commission is truly independent and has robust investigatory powers to make sure that the oversight commission is meaningful and can truly serve the people of Santa Ana. Thank you.

That was our final speaker.

Thai Viet PhanItem 2

Okay, well, they're both gone. All right, so council members, please announce any items that you will be abstaining from due to a conflict and if there are any requests to pull an item from the consent calendar.

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 2

I'll move the calendar.

Thai Viet PhanItem 2

Okay, just announcing in case Mayor, Mayor Pro Tem.

Thai Viet PhanItem 2

I like you chairing.

Thai Viet PhanItem 2

I'll pretend to be mayor pro tem.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Thank you, Madam Clerk, and thank you, the members of the public that addressed us. I'm going to go ahead and now bring it back to the council and the consent calendar items AND ASK IF THERE'S ANY ITEMS THAT COUNCIL MEMBERS WISH TO TAKE OFF THE PULL OFF THE CONSENT CALENDAR OR RECUSE THEMSELVES FROM ON THOSE ITEMS.

Phil BacerraItem 2

ANY TAKERS? MAYOR. COUNCIL MEMBER?

David PenalozaItem 2

I JUST WANT TO MAKE A COMMENT ON NUMBER 14.

David PenalozaItem 2

JUST THANK STAFF FOR THE RESOLUTION OPPOSING THE COUNTY SHELTER IN OUR CITY. I would like to ask if we could maybe put out like an FAQ graphic of some sorts in relation to this resolution what it means and really how it's more of a symbolic on our side and just I've been getting a lot of questions of what residents can do moving forward maybe we could provide some guidance as to to that neighborhood Del High and Madison Park of what this means and to the rest of the industrial areas there. That's it.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Thank you. Thank you for that comment. Let me go ahead and call on Councilmember Fan.

Thai Viet PhanItem 2

Thank you. Nothing to pull, but I do want to make a comment about number seven. I just want to thank both our Parks and Rec staff as well as Public Works for acquiring this property. Hopefully my council colleagues will vote to approve the acquiring of this property. Growing up on the west side, I know exactly where this property is. It's been underutilized for decades, as long as I can remember. And I'm so excited for us to use water funds, primarily water funds, to not only benefit the public and ensure our water is clean, but, well, cleaner even,

Thai Viet PhanItem 2

but also to make it into hopefully a park that we can all visit, especially on the west side. So thank you.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Thank you. Any other? Mayor Pro Tem.

I will poll item 13.

Phil BacerraItem 2

NEW SPEAKERS, ANY OTHER ITEMS THAT COUNCIL MEMBERS WISH TO PULL OFF THE CONSENT? COUNCIL MEMBER HERNANDEZ?

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 2

JUST A QUICK COMMENT ON ITEM NUMBER 7. DIRECTOR NOBIL SABA IN PUBLIC WORKS, FANTASTIC JOB BRINGING THIS OUT AND FORWARD. I'M LOOKING FORWARD TO SUPPORTING IT. THANK YOU.

Phil BacerraItem 2

NEW SPEAKERS, SEEING NO OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS, MY ONLY COMMENT, I'M GOING TO GO AHEAD AND AGREE WITH COUNCIL MEMBER PEÑALOSA ON NUMBER 14 TO THE EXTENT WE CAN DO THAT. And I just want to thank staff for, you know, and especially our city attorney's office and especially Deputy City Attorney John Funk, who I know, you know, fought the good fight at the second hearing. I know we were there on the first and we left very optimistic and really pleased with a great decision. And then we were surprised just a week after with just the contrary. So I know it hasn't been for lack of effort.

Phil BacerraItem 2

And I have tremendous respect for Judge Carter and his clerk staff. and unfortunately though, you know, we have to continue this discussion and it is not over yet. I know that they still haven't found a provider for that site and to the extent we still don't know the meaning of an emergency and we need to continue to, you know, compel the court to understand that we have capacity at both sites that we've been very generous with in our city to provide spaces when other cities have not done likewise.

Phil BacerraItem 2

So I just want to continue to impress upon our staff and our in-house legal counsel to continue this conversation. So in any event, seeing no other comments or questions, I'm going to go ahead and ask for a motion for the balance of the consent calendar. So moved. Second. We have a motion from Mayor Pro Tem, a second from Council Member Hernandez. Council Members, please vote.

Thank you. Motion passes by unanimous consent.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Great. Thank you. I believe it was item 13 that you pulled? Yes. Go ahead.

Thank you, Mayor. This item is in regards to teleconferencing for meetings of city council boards and committees and commissions. Recently, Governor Newsom signed AB 2449 into law. He did that back in September. So in that particular assembly bill, this will modify how we proceed with our meetings in regards to any sort of teleconferencing that we should choose to do. There are two things that stuck out to me that will be a part of AB 2449.

The first one was if a council member or any commissioner or person that chooses to participate via teleconference, the first item was that the member shall publicly disclose at the meeting before any action is taken whether any other individuals are present in the room at the remote location with the member and the general nature of the member's relationship with any such individuals. And then the other item was that the member shall participate through both audio and visual technology. So I think those two provisions are something that are going to

ensure transparency from all the members of any legislative body if there are those that do choose to participate through teleconferencing. So with that, I would like to go ahead and move this item But what I'd like to do is offer up the following amendments. First, I'd like to revise Section 3 to read, shall continue to allow city council members and all other city legislative bodies to meet virtually in accordance with government code Section 54953, subsection E. And then I'd like to add a new Section 4 under Section 3.

And that would read, quote, city council members and members of all legislative bodies shall PUBLICLY DISCLOSE AT THE MEETING BEFORE ANY ACTION IS TAKEN WHETHER ANY OTHER INDIVIDUALS ARE PRESENT IN THE ROOM AT THE REMOTE LOCATION WITH THE MEMBER AND THE GENERAL NATURE OF THE MEMBER'S RELATIONSHIP WITH ANY SUCH INDIVIDUALS, CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS AND MEMBERS OF ALL OTHER LEGISLATIVE BODIES SHALL PARTICIPATE THROUGH BOTH AUDIO AND VISUAL TECHNOLOGY. SO THAT'S MY MOTION.

A MOTION?

Phil BacerraItem 2

WE HAVE A MOTION IN A SECOND FOR PURPOSES OF DISCUSSION. LET ME GO AHEAD AND CALL ON CALILMEMBER FAN.

Thai Viet PhanItem 2

SO JUST FOR CLARIFICATION, THE WAY I UNDERSTAND THE STATE BILL IS THAT IT'S ONLY IN EFFECT, IT'S LIKE ANOTHER OPTION OUTSIDE OF THE TRADITIONAL TELECONFERENCING RULES OUTSIDE OF AB361. and it's typically under Brown Act teleconferencing, if I wanted to call in because YOLO, I'm in Hawaii, right? And I have to let everyone know I'm in this conference room, this hotel, this is where you can be, it's posted on the agenda, you can join me in Hawaii. That's traditional Brown Act teleconferencing. AB 361 only allows for this 30-day resolution if there is a declared state of emergency and it must be re-upped every 30 days.

Thai Viet PhanItem 2

the new state law says that in addition to traditional Brown Act teleconferencing and in addition to the AB 361 we have this other newfangled teleconferencing rule to allow us to do teleconferencing say after the agenda is posted and I'm just trying to understand what we're looking or else are we gonna update this A 30-day resolution every time to include that?

All I'm saying right now is that with this particular item that we have to re-up every 30 days, I'm adding these two provisions in there. And I don't think there's anything that would prevent our council from adding those provisions. I understand that eventually those will be law through AB 2449. But what I'm saying is to add these two today as a part of this under AB 361 that we have to constantly reapprove every 30 days.

Thai Viet PhanItem 2

I do want to talk to Madam City Attorney because the new law is actually in addition and separate from AB 361. And I think that there is some concern about preemption and we mandate that they have to be on camera under AB 361. Yeah.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Council member, why don't we call on the Madam City Attorney.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 2

That's right. So here's, there are three different laws that apply to your meetings. I guess you could say there's three different laws that apply to your meetings. You have the AB 361, which you have the discretion to approve or not to approve. You do not have to do that. You have the existing Brown Act requirements, and then you have these new requirements are going to go into effect. You don't get to pick and choose and bundle them. 361 is offered to you, so you can either make the findings and adopt the 361 ordinance or nothing. Meaning nothing is then you are going to default to the Brown Act.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 2

And the city council, even as a charter city, does not have the authority to make law on an issue like the Brown Act, which applies to all public agencies. So you could adopt, in addition to that, a policy. I have drafted a policy for the city clerk's office that's very particular about how we're going to operate. But I think you either take 361 in its current form, you say yes or no, or you defer to the Brown Act provisions, which would require you to post a hotel room until the new law takes effect.

Thai Viet PhanItem 2

But I guess I think part of the concern is making sure we disclose who we're in the room with and having the camera on. Is that something we're able to do under AP 361?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 2

So I think that you may be able to do that as a practice. You know, your charter says that you can have rules under a practice, but I would not amend 361. I would say if this is Mayor Pro Tem's desire, what my recommendation would be have us come back in a policy and how we're going to operate. So yes, under 361, we're going to allow people to participate via teleconference, but it's going to be our policy that we're going to ask people to do this. And if they don't do it, well, then we may not adopt re-up 361, because they're not complying with our policy. But I would recommend against changing this resolution,

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 2

because you've got to follow the state law.

Thai Viet PhanItem 2

Thank you. That was all my questions. OKAY.

WELL, THEN AT THIS POINT I'M GOING TO RECOMMEND THAT WE NO LONGER CONTINUE PROVISIONS UNDER AB 361. SO THAT'S MY MOTION.

Phil BacerraItem 2

GREAT. COUNCILMEMBER FAN.

Thai Viet PhanItem 2

I'D LIKE TO MAKE A SUBMOTION TO ACTUALLY ADOPT THIS BECAUSE JUST TODAY THE COUNTY OF ORANGE JUST DECLARED AN EMERGENCY REGARDING THE FLU SEASON AND HOW HORRIBLE IT IS RIGHT NOW. and so I actually do have some concerns regarding that aspect. I'll be seconding your sub-motion.

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 2

I'll second your sub-motion.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Okay, so we already have a substitute motion by Council Member Fan and a second on that substitute motion by Council Member Lopez. Is there any discussion on the substitute motion?

Phil BacerraItem 2

Go ahead. You have a question to your motion?

Thai Viet PhanItem 2

Yes, actually. Madam City Attorney, I know it's not agendized, but you did say we can bring back a policy or something about keeping our camera on and disclosing who we're in our room with. I mean, can I make that part of my sub-motion? Would that be okay with you? I think you just give us direction.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 2

I was just looking for the policy that I drafted and I was going to recirculate it. So we can do that.

Thai Viet PhanItem 2

All right. Well, I don't need to amend my sub-motion then.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Excellent. So we have a substitute motion by Council Member Fan, a second by Lopez. Seeing no other questions or comments, let's vote on that first.

Motion passes 6-1 with Councilmember Hernandez Lopez Mendoza Peñalosa and Mayor Samiento voting yes and Mayor Potem Becerra dissenting.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Great. Thank you for that. So that finishes our consent calendar portion of the meeting. Let me go ahead and move along to the business calendar. Item number 15, the ordinance establishing a police review commission. I'll go ahead and turn it over to staff for a presentation.

Thank you, Mayor. We do have a brief presentation on what the changes are that are in the draft before you, if you would like to see that.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Sure, go ahead.

Daniel Soto from the city manager's office will give that presentation.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Daniel's getting good at this. This is the fourth time we've seen a presentation on this one.

Good evening, Mayor and City Council. As mentioned, the presentation is brief and will outline some of the changes that the City Attorney prepared in the ordinance that is in the agenda packet and prepared for your consideration tonight.

As directed by the City Council, the City Attorney made the following changes to the ordinance. The full text of the ordinance is in the agenda packet and a summary of the changes and the summary of the different provisions are included in the staff report. The first change involves qualifications of commissioners. It allows peace officers who have been separated from their governmental entity or employer for at least five years to serve on the commission. The ordinance also provides that no more than one peace officer at a time will serve on the police oversight commission.

The changes also remove a prohibition of government employees that was part of the original draft. The next section regards subject to language. The subject to language was added to six different sections of the ordinance, and those sections are cited in the slide on your screen.

The next section of changes involves the powers and duties of the Police Oversight Commission. The first is the original draft ordinance that was presented at the last meeting had a menu list of three items under the subsection B of what was originally labeled section 662. The City Council directed that staff proceed with the first subsection B. And that's reflected in the ordinance presented today. The changes also authorize the Police Oversight Commission to receive, hear, and review misconduct complaints.

That includes complaints alleging police officer misconduct, tort claims, or lawsuits filed against a police officer alleging misconduct.

The ordinance allows the receipt of anonymous complaints, allows complaints to be filed are submitted within 180 days of the alleged misconduct by a police officer or within one year from persons who are incapacitated due to health and or who have been incarcerated.

The updated ordinance also authorizes the Commission to make disciplinary recommendations to the police chief and or the city manager when misconduct is sustained.

The next section involves, the next section of changes is regarding access to police department records, data, and reports. As drafted, the ordinance authorizes the Commission and Independent Oversight Director to have access to all Police Department records subject to all federal, state, and local laws, and it requires all data legally disclosed to the California Department of Justice and or any other federal or state law enforcement agency to be concurrently provided to the Police Oversight Commission and the Independent Oversight Director.

tonight you have an ordinance for first reading if the ordinance is approved by the city council today staff will return with a with the ordinance for a second reading at the November 15th city council meeting if the ordinance is adopted at the November 15th city council meeting it will become effective in 30 days during that time staff will be working on a detailed implementation plan and we've already got started. Staff reached out to the National Association on Civilian Oversight of Law Enforcement last week and is working with them to engage them to provide technical assistance to guide staff with preparing this detailed plan,

as well as to provide ongoing technical assistance and training, which are outlined in the ordinance. If you have any questions about the ordinance, the city attorney is available, and any other questions about the implementation, I'm here. Thank you.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Thank you for that presentation, and before I bring it back to the council, I just want to say thank you to staff, especially Daniel Soto, the city attorney's office, for working closely with members of the public and the advocacy groups that have been working on this for quite a long time. And thank you to the council for remaining so engaged. I know we had a couple of work study sessions on this and several iterations of what we're considering now. As we know, there are certain guardrails on this policy that we cannot overcome, and those are our city charter. It also includes the police officer's bill of rights

Phil BacerraItem 2

and obviously civil service protections that are embedded in state law. So we know those are thresholds that we can't address tonight. We will do as much as we can, given the interest of making sure we want a commission of residents that will be as robust as we possibly can with those limitations. And so we know that going forward, there may be some changes. The charter would need to be reconsidered and possibly amended to the extent that there is more autonomy warranted and needed by future counsel and members of the public.

Phil BacerraItem 2

So for that, it just really is now for us to be able to address some of the amendments. And as I looked at them, Madam City Attorney, I didn't see any material departures from what we looked at before. I think a lot of it included clarifications, different versions of what we first saw from the draft that was presented to us at the last meeting. So to the extent that we consider some of those this evening, would you like to address some of those for us? and maybe you can save us a lot of time and see if there's any issues that you may need some policy direction on.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Because on the legal constraints, those are obviously clear that we will not and shall not overcome those by any changes by the council. But to the extent that there are policy questions that you think you still need some clarification on from us, that would be helpful.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 2

Thank you, Mayor. Mayor Potem, members of the city council. As Mr. Soto went through tonight, we made the changes, the 11 changes that were directed at the last meeting. We prepared for your consideration and ordinance for your first reading. Under laws, you can make changes to that first reading. And we did receive some comments and input from the community through a letter submitted by the ACLU. In that comment letter and in a revised ordinance, nine issues were raised. I'm going to very, very quickly go over them. In Section 660, their request is to change language regarding the purpose.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 2

I did point out to them that this change, if it's acceptable to the City Council as it's presented to you, would be legally okay so long as we made it clear that the Commission would be acting through the independent oversight director. As I've advised you before, the Commission cannot hold certain powers. It's the delegation of investigatory powers under the city charter section 1100. So that would be section 660. If you're okay with the change of the language with what I've suggested, that would be fine. The second issue presented to you is under qualifications.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 2

City Council had given us direction, but they are once again asking for the city to prohibit anyone who's currently a sworn peace officer or any member of a peace officer's family. That's a policy issue. You'll have to make that decision last time you decided to exclude it. They're asking for you to include it. Number three, the police department had made an optional suggestion in the ordinance saying in order to comply with legal statutes of confidentiality of police records, they're asking that there be a limited records check required of commissioners. This is item number three.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 2

This is not a legal issue as far as we're concerned. There are some laws that pertain to the confidentiality of records and what types of individuals can be admitted to the police department in certain areas. But this is really a policy decision for you to decide. Number four, in Section 2-664, they want to add that the city manager or their designee would also attend the commission meetings. Currently it provides that the independent oversight director as well as PD staff would do that and they are asking that the City Manager assign staff as well. That's a policy issue. Section 2-665, powers and duties of the Commission.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 2

They've questioned why we put in additional language regarding San Ana Police Department's policies and procedures and that we comply. We explained to them why we have to comply with them and we're suggesting that we add a clarifying section and subsection M to address this issue and they were actually agreeable to that suggestion. Number six, they wanted to clarify that per the city charter, the authority delegated to the independent oversight director would also include the right to administer oaths and compel the production of evidence. We took a look at that and we actually think that that's a good change as it's consistent

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 2

with the city charter. Number seven, they want to add language to require the police chief and the city manager to respond to reports and recommendations of the commission within 30 days. We did explain to them that we do not believe that 30 days is sufficient amount of time. There's a lot of business to be conducted, but we did defer and say that is a policy issue and you may want to seek the input from staff and particularly the city manager.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 2

The next thing they want to do is add requirements for additional mandated reports. So they want the police department to report on the number of disciplinary recommendations issued by the chief or the city manager, and they want reports or recommendations submitted to the City Council Chief and City Manager concerning commission regulations, legislation, et cetera. We see that as a policy issue. That's number eight. And finally, number nine, they want to require that the commission report shall be posted on the City's website. Again we defer to you as that's a policy matter.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 2

So as you can see of the nine issues, two were considered legal and we feel like we've resolved both legal issues. We will leave the other seven to you.

Phil BacerraItem 2

Great. Thank you for that summary. Let me go ahead now bring it back to the Council to see if there's any questions or comments. Councilmember Hernandez.

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 2

Thank you, Mayor Sarmiento. First and foremost, Madam City Attorney, thank you for your responsiveness to the community and making sure that these questions were answered immediately. I'm in alignment and in agreement with what the community is asking for. I'm happy that under Section 6.660-Purpose, they were agreeable to this suggestion. So, I am happy to see that. Under Section 6.662 qualifications, I would like to see us add any person who is currently a sworn peace officer or a member of a peace officer's immediate family

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 2

shall not be eligible for appointment on the commission. So, I would like to see this policy issue amended to the Oversight Commission under Section 3. They want the Council to reject the PD's request for this language. I am supportive of us moving this. This would be a commission no different than any other commission where members of the public are subjected to ethics and to codes. And more importantly, there is already a confidentiality agreement in place for any commissioner who is going to be tasked with sitting on this commission.

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 2

So I don't think that it is necessary to move forward with having these background checks. I don't think that this is something we can support as a city. It's not a practice that we're implementing across any other commission, which is why I'm not supporting that additional language by the San Ana Police Department. On Section 4-2-664 meetings, I am supportive of ensuring that our city manager designates staff to attend some of these meetings. I also would like to see some amendments to this language under Section 2-664.

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 2

There is a sentence that says the police chief or their designee. I would like to see a comma after designee, the city manager or their designee shall attend. I would like to see a removal of the word all. Shall attend regular and special meetings of the commission and provide regular staff support to the commission when requested by the commission. I think that that brings a lot of clarity to section 2-664-meetings. Under Section 2-665, Powers and Duties of the Police Oversight Commission, I am supportive of Item Number 5.

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 5

I would like to see a clarifying section be amended. I see that the community did agree to this suggestion. Is that correct, Madam City Attorney?

Yes.

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 5

Okay, wonderful. Under Item Number 6, I would like to see, I see that they wanted to clarify that the per the city charter, the authority delegated to the independent oversight director would include the right to administer oaths and compel the production of evidence. In your document, you submitted to us, it says, we see this as being consistent with the city charter and recommend it. I would like to move forward and make sure that that language is added as well. Under Section 7, I'm looking at your document here, they want to add language to require

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 5

Police Chief and City Manager to respond to reports and recommendations within 30 days. Madam City Attorney, are you saying that 30 days is not a sufficient amount of time?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 5

I'm going to defer to the City Manager because this requirement would apply to her and her employee. Okay.

Thank you City Attorney. Council Member Hernandez, depending on the volume of the report and the number of items, 30 days could be a quick turnaround if I could respectfully request 60 days.

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 5

I would be indulgent to support 60 days if you think that that is going to help us ensure that this commission is both effective and efficient. If it's a matter of staff capacity and this is that compromise, this is a compromise I think that we can make. Under Section 8A and 8B, I am supportive of the requirements for additional mandated reports from PD. Those reports that I would like to see is the number of disciplinary recommendations issued to the police chief and city manager, as well as the number of recommendations accepted and rejected. In addition to that, I would also like to see the reports or recommendations submitted

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 5

to the city council, the police chief and city manager concerning commission's regulations, legislation or budgetary allocation and police department policies, procedures, customs, orders, collective bargaining agreements, programs, training, as well as the appropriate party's response to reports or recommendations. And lastly, under item 9 on your document, Madam City Attorney, they will want to require the Commission reports shall be posted on the City's website and open to public inspection except for the information contained therein that is confidential and prohibited from disclosure

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 9

under any other applicable law shall be redacted. I am supportive of the community's request as well. On the topic of, there's a key section I wanted to talk about. On the topic of Section 2-665, Powers and Duties of the Police Oversight Commission, in your presentation, Daniel Soto, you shared that we are allowing complaints to be filed and submitted within 180 days of the alleged misconduct by a Santa Ana police officer or within one year from persons who are incapacitated due to health and or have been incarcerated.

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 9

I would like to see us include language that also includes mental health, trauma, that includes both any physical trauma, any psychological trauma, and furthermore, even people who have not had access to adequate mental health. If an individual is submitting a complaint and does state that they have had trauma as a result of their incarceration or as a result of their interaction with law enforcement, I would also like to see us be able to include language that allows those people

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 9

who oftentimes are victims of these instances where we see the public recording somebody getting beat up by police or being pushed off of a bicycle on Main Street, we want to make sure that those members of the community have a sufficient amount of time and that it's not predicated on them being in the hospital or them being in jail. Oftentimes, the lingering effects of police misconduct are not very visible. A lot of that trauma is psychological. A lot of that trauma comes in the effect of isolating and not wanting to be outside of your home. So it's very important that we include that language.

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 9

That concludes my amendments, Madam City Attorney. Thank you.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Great. Thank you for those comments. Let me go ahead and call on other members of the Council that may have questions or comments.

Thank you, Solzhen.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Mayor Pro Tem.

Thank you, Mayor. You know, the good thing is as we're deliberating on this draft ordinance that's before us this evening, I'm happy to say that the ad hoc committee, which consisted of very diverse opinions on our police, actually agreed on some of the key components of police oversight, and they are present in this draft ordinance. There's also some items where we didn't agree, and that's okay. We knew that ultimately, though, that this item would come back before the full Council for the discussion we're having now. I want to thank our staff for taking all those

opinions and trying to weave it into this ordinance that we have here. One thing I want to remind everybody that we should appreciate is the fact that we're not doing this exercise in response to something. We're not here because we've had this terrible experience out there and that we're all convening in an emergency setting because we've seen some major terrible incidences happening. You know this isn't Los Angeles of the 1990s, this is an Anaheim of 2012. Instead we're trying to make sure that our police continue to serve our community in a professional manner with transparency and

accountability to our community. So this leads me to the discussion that I want to have about the draft ordinance and I'll start with some of the recitals. So So in Section A under the recitals, I would like to see us remove the words that come after the words establishing civilian oversight. When Councilmember Pelosa and I first started talking about bringing this item forward to the Council, our conversations were not about the protests of 2020. In fact, we talked about the same reasons that were discussed prior to 2020. In fact, as many of the speakers tonight talked about, this is something that's been discussed

for almost 60 years. So this is not about the protests. This is about whether you support police, whether you have issues with the police. We all want to see the same thing. We want accountability and we want transparency. So that was something that I felt talking about the widespread protests in 2020 as some sort of motive for us to do this today. That was not accurate. The first sentence in section B and C under the recitals also don't reflect why we have this ordinance before us today. In both of those sections actually it's the sentence that follows those first

sentences that are more accurate. So in section B we have the Santa Ana PD and the City Council are committed to working together to build trust and improve public safety. And then in section C the City Council is committed to exploring ways to reduce liability through improvements in police operations through continued transparency. And I would tell you that, at least for myself, those are two good reasons why I think many people in the city would support police oversight. Sections E and F strike the right tone as well for why we're moving forward. In fact, Section E states that the establishment of the Police

Oversight Commission will support democratic governance and lead to an even more professional, well-managed, accountable, and highly functioning police department. I can keep going on and on, but the one thing I want to conclude with on the recitals, in section F it talks about the Police Oversight Commission's desire to improve law enforcement operations and sustain community trust. In other words, improve our police department by enhancing transparency and accountability. So I'm going to go into some of the meat and potatoes of what I'd like to see changed in the draft ordinance.

Again, thank you staff for what you've put before us. In section 2-668, it states that the commission shall have complete and prompt access to all police department records, information and data, including but not limited to audio, video recordings, photographs, police reports, etc. Madam City Attorney, does our personnel commission have the same level of access to police department records and data that we are proposing for this police oversight commission to have?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

If the police personnel, if the personnel board in connection with the review of a disciplinary matter were to request the documentation, they could have access to the documentation in order to make their decision.

But the way that this is written shall have complete and prompt access. In other words, it sounds like the personnel commission has very tailored, very succinct access, where it sounds like for this, what we're proposing for the police oversight commission sounds a little more broader. And I'm not in any way concerned about us granting that to the Police Oversight Commission, but I just want to draw that distinction that the Personnel Commission does not have the same access that the Police Oversight Commission would have, correct?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

So I don't think, you know, I think your comments about the language are on point, but I don't think that even these words, having complete and prompt access, would in any way impact the state laws, the policies and procedures, or any other laws that protect these records. So throughout this ordinance we have added that subsection M that in all areas would say this, and but it's subject to all these state laws. So I understand the issue with the complete and prompt access. It's more stylistic because complete and prompt will certainly depend on conformance with all the state laws, just like the personnel board.

Well, no, I, the reason why.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

We'd like to remove that. I can, we, and that's acceptable.

No, no, no, no, no. I'm not, I'm not suggesting we remove that. What I'm going towards is the fact that when we talk about background checks, and I think there were some folks that had drawn this distinction between, you know, the Personnel Commission or I'm sorry, not distinction, trying to bring together the fact that you have the Police Oversight Commission, the Personnel Commission almost acting very similar. But I think there are some differences. And I personally, at least for me, will support some sort of background check. I don't think it limits the ability of the community to participate in the Police Oversight Commission.

That's not what we're trying to do here. But we are dealing with something that's very sensitive. And if you don't think it is, I mean, look at the fact that our staff has had to go through many layers, whether it's state law, federal law, poll bar, all these different layers. So there's obviously a lot to have to contend with. So to me, that should illustrate the sensitivity of what we're dealing with. So I personally support the proposed language to add in at least for the limited records checks. I mean, I don't see any problem with that.

As far as prohibiting family members of retired peace officers from serving on the commission, I'm surprised. I mean, I always can be surprised by something new sitting up here, but I'm really surprised that we're actually looking to prohibit people's service based on what somebody else did. That's astounding. So, because somebody else made the choice to serve as a peace officer, we want to limit somebody else's ability to serve our community. I mean, for those of you that have spouses, life partners, I'm sure you know that just because you're related or committed doesn't mean you 100% agree with each other.

So I think trying to limit the ability for someone to serve just because their partner or spouse has a chosen career, I just, that seems very contrary to many of the things that we espouse up here on this dais. I think it's important for the police oversight commissioners to get out there on ride-alongs with our officers. You know, it's important to get out there and see what the officers are doing. I don't think that they have to be out there for an entire shift as many of you know that are following our officers they work long shifts but at the same time I don't want them to do a lap around the block around the police

department headquarters so I would like to add in section 2-663 B1 I'd like to amend that to read participate in a ride-along with the San Diego Police Department for a minimum duration of two hours and every six months thereafter so So at the very least two hours to get out there with our officers to see what they are contending with and what they face. I agree with the additional components of training that are being proposed out there for Section 2-663. I think with this amount of training, these commissioners are probably going to be able to compete with half the cadets in the academy.

So that's probably not a bad thing after all. I'd like to see the last sentence in Section 2-664 revised to include that the city manager or their designee attend the meetings. So that sentence would read, the police chief or their designee and the city manager or their designee shall attend all regular and special meetings of the commission. I think that, you know, the talk of this idea that the presence of police there would somehow sway the, sway how the commission acts. I mean, our police chiefs in the audience, and no disrespect, chief, but I'm going to deliberate the way I deliberate, whether you're here or not.

And the same goes for our city manager, our city attorney. So honestly, I think it's important for the police chief or his designate to be in the room because if we're talking about the police, don't you think the police chief should hear what is being discussed about the police department? So I respectfully disagree about the idea of not including the police chief in these meetings. I think the police chief should be there. In regards to section 2-665B, I agree with the language that the committee shall receive HERE AND REVIEW MISCONDUCT COMPLAINTS. MADAM CITY ATTORNEY, I WANTED TO ASK, SO IS IT APPROPRIATE FOR A COMMISSION,

WHETHER WE'RE TALKING ABOUT POLICE OVERSIGHT OR THE PLANNING COMMISSION, TO REVIEW ACTIVE TORT CLAIMS OR LAWSUITS PRIOR TO THEIR RESOLUTION?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

WHEN YOU SAY WHETHER IT'S PROPER, UNDER STATE LAW, ALL LAWSUITS AND TORT CLAIMS ARE SUBJECT TO DISCLOSURE. SO ANYBODY CAN SEE THEM AND HAVE AN OPINION AS TO THEM ANYWAY. So when we say they would review the misconduct complaints, tort claims, or lawsuits, there's nothing under the state law that would disallow that.

Okay. And I don't say that because I want us not to be transparent. I say that just more out of concern for liability. I just don't want to have us put ourselves in a position where we're having discussions that later we're shooting ourselves in the foot.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

Yeah, and you might recall that an earlier version as proposed by the community, they actually did want to make recommendations and they wanted to get like into the Council's business as to settling claims. And we said no, that would not be appropriate. But simply reviewing it and it doesn't say here what exactly they might do with that information other than they might make recommendations, we determined that it would be okay, it's a policy decision for the Council because anyone can get access to those items anyway.

Okay. And then I have another question regarding Section 2-665, but this time it's subsection C2. So, and this is in regards to the timing for which somebody can submit a claim, or not claim, I'm sorry, a complaint to the commission. So if POBAR requires investigations and discipline of police officers to be instituted within a year, is it feasible for the commission to accept and review these complaints from people who are incapacitated due to health or incarceration up to one year after the alleged misconduct?

And again, this is not to limit their ability, but I just want to make sure that if we're going to allow it, does it, I mean, like, are we giving them false hope? Like, hey, you have up to a year to submit, oh, by the way, guess what? By the time that the person who took in the claim actually got it to the director, you know, the time had expired for any substantive action to possibly be taken.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

You may recall that the original staff recommendation was much shorter than this. I think that we had included 60 or 90 days for those very reasons, but we did receive direction from the council to extend these time periods. As is clear by our numerous comments, nothing that this commission does will have any impact on discipline of any type whatsoever. And that one year applies to discipline under POBAR. So they could look at claims that are two years old and make recommendations. It's not going to impact the police officers at all.

So, okay. And I'm glad you said that, Madam City Attorney. So to be clear that, so when these complaints are filed, the expectation that somehow this will impact the discipline of the officers, that is not realistic. Because again, because of POBAR, not the city charter, not city code, but because of POBAR, you have a set timeframe. And so if there is somebody that's going to submit a complaint due to health or incarceration, they can exercise what some of the council is proposing for the year, but they have to have the expectation that there's not going to be the ability to impact any sort of discipline

OF AN OFFICER SHOULD THERE BE A DISCIPLINE WARRANTED. THAT'S CORRECT. OKAY. SECTION 2-665F13, IT ALLOWS FOR THE COMMISSION TO MAKE DISCIPLINARY RECOMMENDATIONS TO THE POLICE CHIEF AND OR CITY MANAGER WHEN A COMPLAINT OF MISCONDUCT HAS BEEN SUSTAINED. SO IN THIS SECTION, IS THERE, HOW DO I SAY THIS, DO THE STATE LAWS OR, YOU KNOW, THAT ARE CITED IN THIS SECTION, DO THEY HELP GUIDE THE COMMISSION IN MAKING THE APPROPRIATE DISCIPLINARY RECOMMENDATION. SO IN OTHER WORDS, YOU KNOW, IT'S LIKE FOR INSTANCE, YOU WOULD SAY, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE NOT GOING TO THROW SOMEBODY IN JAIL FOR JAYWALKING, RIGHT?

THAT'S NOT THE APPROPRIATE REACTION TO THAT ACTION. SO IN THE CASE HERE, WHAT WILL GUIDE THIS COMMISSION WHEN IT COMES TO PROPOSING DISCIPLINARY RECOMMENDATION BECAUSE TERMINATION IS NOT GOING TO BE THE ANSWER FOR EVERY COMPLAINT. So, is there, you know, we talk about POBAR, we talk about state law, obviously we talked about the charter and the code, but what will hopefully guide the commission when it comes to steering them towards recommending the appropriate disciplinary recommendations?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

There is no guide, there's no formula as to discipline. They will look at their policies and practices that may do that. We might even look to how our personnel board might have handled an issue. They'll look to the records of that. Do you have another? Certainly.

Civil service dictates progressive discipline. So that's what prevents you from escalating something with no past history of discipline issues to a termination unless it's really egregious. So civil service guidelines would be one of those regulations that they would need to follow.

Okay. AND PERHAPS MAYBE IN WHAT COMES BACK TO US, SOMETHING SHOULD BE INCORPORATED IN HERE. JUST BECAUSE WHAT I WANT TO MAKE SURE IS THAT WHEN THE COMMUNITY READS THIS, THEY UNDERSTAND. WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE ALL DEALING WITH THE SAME THING. WE UNDERSTAND IT THE SAME WAY. AND SO I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WHEN WE LOOK AT WHAT THOSE POTENTIAL DISCIPLINARY ACTIONS ARE, THAT EVERYBODY HAS THE SAME UNDERSTANDING OF THAT. I would also, you know, the annual report that's required per section 2-665K, I'd like to see that readily available to the community. So I would like to add the following language to the end of 2-665K.

I would like to say that this report shall be posted on the city's website and open to public inspection, subject to all federal, state, and local laws, including any and all restrictions set forth in the Charter, Muni Code, and POBAR, Government Code Section 330 and all. And then this one's going to be kind of a more area of conversation.

So our city, we have a council manager form of government. And how the manager versus the council governs and who they govern and what they oversee. So when I look at Section 2-666 of this ordinance, it indicates that the city council, not the city manager, would appoint the independent oversight director. But since the oversight director's scope of operations goes beyond inquiry, and I think there's mention in the charter about, you know, if it's an inquiry-related issue, then yes, the council can initiate that appointment or that hiring. But because we're dealing with the administrative branch

government i think the city manager mentioned that we've got civil service when it comes to how we deal with personnel issues and employment um i i just want to make sure that we're on solid legal ground when we talk about this idea that that council would hire this particular person and i'll tell you right now i don't know that there's any one of us up here that comes into city hall and and deals with jason mozick about personnel and make sure certain forms are filed and proof of insurance is collected. So thank God we have a city manager and her staff that deals with all that.

But in this particular instance here, is this appropriate for us to do it?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

I read two sections together to offer this section. I acknowledge that there could be those who would argue that the council does not have the legal authority to create a new appointed officer. I acknowledge that that could be something that one would allege. My response to that is based on Section 700 of the city charter, as well as what we call statutory interpretation that we lawyers rely upon in case law. Section 700 says the council may provide by ordinance, not inconsistent with the charter, not inconsistent with the charter, for the organization, conduct, and operation of the several offices. Offices have officers.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

Departments and other agencies of the city. And then when you go on to section 701, it's titled Officers Appointed by the Council. This section says that in addition to the city manager, the city council shall appoint the city attorney, and also makes reference to an appointed city clerk. It says nowhere in this section that those are the only ones that may be appointed. Some charters say that. Our charter is very clear. There's going to be a lot of deference, in my opinion, by, let's say, a judicial officer reviewing this to look at the powers of the administrative branch, your executive branch of government.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

And I think that because 701 is not restrictive, it says that you shall do something, but it doesn't say that you can't do more than that. And Section 700 says you can do more than that. So I think that there will be a lot of deference given to how the city council exercises its powers under the charter. What we also know that you can't do is you cannot interfere with the powers of the city manager. manager, and I think if the City Council were trying to create a civil service position, or otherwise trying to tell the City Manager how to operate the city outside of this charter, I don't think that would be permitted.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

But I do, as I said last time, think that we have woven together authority of the Council to create this position. It would be an issue of first impression, I admit, but this entire process has been one of compromise and trying to meet the Council's demands as well as the community. I think a very strong argument could be made that you have this authority.

I appreciate that. One thing I would ask though is that when it comes to how our city deals with land use, we have a prescriptive code. In other words, we don't just say because it's not specifically mentioned in the code, it's allowed. In fact, I believe, and correct me if I'm wrong, we actually say that if it's not stated in our code, that it's not allowed. Is that correct?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

You do. But see, you adopted an ordinance saying that. You created that policy. And your voters, when presented with the charter, had the same right to create that kind of policy, and they didn't. And that's where I think that a judicial officer would not step in and second-guess your voters or second-guess the city council. But your point is well taken. A policy decision was made. Some land use codes don't have that language. Some land use codes leave it open, and therefore when we are asked to opine on that, we say, well, since you don't have that restrictive provision in your code, I guess it's permitted.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

So that's why it comes down to an issue of statutory interpretation. And so we look to the case law that has interpreted charters. We don't make this up. We go and we say, okay, that case has stated that where it's not prohibited by the charter,

that the council has these authorities. Okay. I just, my two cents for my colleagues is I would WANT TO HAVE US, BECAUSE OBVIOUSLY WE NEED THIS INDEPENDENT OVERSIGHT DIRECTOR. I KIND OF FEEL LIKE THIS IS A LEGAL LEAP OF FAITH, JUST MY PERSONAL OPINION, AND I FEEL THAT, YOU KNOW, PERHAPS MAYBE SOMETHING COULD COME BACK TO US THAT WOULD ALLOW THIS OVERSIGHT COMMISSION ONCE IT'S, YOU KNOW, GOT AT LEAST A QUORUM OR MORE TO THEN MAYBE PERHAPS, YOU KNOW, IN CONJUNCTION WITH THE CITY MANAGER, MAKE RECOMMENDATIONS ON WHO TO HIRE TO THE CITY MANAGER AND MAYBE THAT WAY

keeping it away from the council really kind of enshrining some sort of independence for this commission so that might be something for us to consider but i just my only reason bringing this up is just to make sure that we're on solid legal ground the last thing i want to see is this thing challenged because of something with good intentions but just bad execution um other than that i just you know as much as i'm grilling you sonia i do want to thank you and your staff for for trying to as you said weave this together and everybody we all of us collectively should be proud of the

fact that we are being proactive not reactive and so that this item before us tonight is symbolic of the fact that we all want to see good policing that's responsive to our community in Santa Ana and most importantly we want it to be transparent and we want to be accountable we want our police to be transparent and accountable and I hope that when we're done with this tonight that will be the So thank you.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Thank you for those comments. Let me call on the last, the other council member that sat on the ad hoc committee. I'll call on Council Member Lopez.

Jessie LopezItem 9

Thank you, Mayor.

Jessie LopezItem 9

Are you ready, staff?

Jessie LopezItem 9

I am supportive of the nine policy recommendations that were provided to us in the brief. I am also supportive of well that leads me to a different question which is part of the language that we have in the current ordinance if I am saying I am supportive of not mandating you know potential candidates to serve on the Commission or anyone that gets appointed to the Commission then therefore one of those policy recommendations is that I would not support the background check then therefore when we're mandating commissioners to do these ride-alongs

Jessie LopezItem 9

that would until that would have them be subjected to a background check which I'm fine if they want to do that the difference is that not you know if they want to if they want to go ahead and do the ride-along when I did my ride along with the Met team I had to do I had to go through the same process and So I think it's fine if they want to do it independently and just being consistent with the other commissions that we have because I heard consistency be a big factor here. We don't mandate other commissioners to go through background checks to be appointed through to our commissions.

Jessie LopezItem 9

So that was the one distinction I wanted to make with the nine policy recommendations that I'm supporting. I am also going to be supporting, I actually have a question for you city attorney because nowhere in the draft that we were given and correct me if I am wrong I didn't see any language that protects commissioners from retaliatory behavior and so I wanted to know if that was something well in my I guess in my personal opinion I would like some sort of language to be there just because I see what's happening in the city of LA

Jessie LopezItem 9

and how the commissioners are being treated there and so I wanted to know if it was in your legal view something that is pertinent for this ordinance to

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

include um it was it was included in the community what I call the community's original draft and one of the reasons we didn't include it is because we can't as a City Council regulate the behavior of members of the community we certainly would not allow any of our staff members to retaliate and that's something that the city manager can address and the human resources department and so we would know that there's no one at City Hall but when you talk about retaliation one of the concerns I had is if it's going to be a public commission in a public meeting when people come up to the microphone

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

and exercise our First Amendment rights what they're saying may be an exercise of their opinion and then we might have other people saying well they're retaliating against me, right, because of a view that I held. And I didn't want to get into a position where we're regulating that speech. And there's really no retaliation unless there's some, in the law, in employment law, there's some adverse effect. So really the only people that could retaliate against them, the commissioners, are the city council who would remove them.

Jessie LopezItem 9

Right. Well, I guess it would be language that would be inclusive of even the council at that point. If it could be a policy suggestion.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

Yeah, I mean, I think if the Council wanted to, if there was majority support for that, that we could potentially add a section that addresses how commissioners are removed. But we already have that, and so I was trying to be consistent and didn't want to give these commissioners any special, like, you know, anti-removal protection that the other commissioners don't have. But if you guys wanted to address that, what you could do is later you could come back and address that section of your municipal code that deals with the removal of commissioners. And you could add protections for all your commissioners.

Jessie LopezItem 9

Okay. Thank you for that clarification. I also wanted to add under, I have a different version of the exhibit. So I believe it's under Section 665 under the list of the following types of alleged misconduct by officers. I wanted to include, because I believe that the first section doesn't include, the first line is uses of force that result in great bodily injury. And one of the exhibits that I'm reading stops there. So I just wanted to include or death towards the end.

Jessie LopezItem 9

And I also wanted to include part of that list.

Jessie LopezItem 9

Yes, also PD pursuits that result in collision or injury, unlawful stops, searches and or arrests, unlawful denial of access to counsel, and interference with the First Amendment assemblies, association or expression, and or any other allegations of misconduct or civil rights. I wanted that to be consistent because there's two different sections in the ordinance that list those that lists those I guess incidents we'll call them. And I also wanted to there's part of the exhibit

Jessie LopezItem 9

now states the that the reports are going to be giving to the city manager the and this director and I just wanted to include the police department so all three entities just so that all of everyone receives the reports that the Commission is bringing forth I think that'll help with consistency and another issue I wanted to address was I think in the exhibit we have we added language that states you know some of these policy or procedures will be based

Jessie LopezItem 9

on the policy or procedures being provided by the department and part of the public language or comment that I heard today was that those policies or procedures could change, right? So I just wanted to make sure that we struck that because in the future I think a new policy could be brought forth that hinders the spirit of the commission, the work that they're trying to do. So I just wanted to state that for you.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

And I think that's going to be addressed in our comments where we suggested that we add that subsection M because it's going to be in that subsection that says to the extent that policies and procedures of the department are amended, let's say to comply with state law, they cannot be amended in a way that will conflict with this ordinance. Okay, great. That's a catch-all.

Jessie LopezItem 9

Thank you for that. I think that's going to be my first round of comments, Mayor. Thank you.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Great, thank you. So we've heard from all members of the ad hoc committee, so I'll go ahead and open it up to the rest of the members of the council that didn't serve on the ad hoc and if they wish to have any comments for the record. Councilmember Mendoza.

Thank you.

As to the nine opposed amendments, on number one, and my comments are brief because my colleagues have already expanded on them. So number one, I agree with staff. Number two, I do not agree. Number three, I would like to include that a background check be done for the members. It is only proper that we have a background check done on people who serve our commissions. I've had a background check on every commission I've served.

We do backgrounds on people who work with children, people who work with seniors. So it's appropriate that everyone have a background check.

Number 5, it's agreeable. Number 6, I agree. Number 7, it is proper that we change 30 days to 60 days.

Number 8, I agree with Steph. And number 9, that is, it's no problem. I think that that would be appropriate. Number 9, I agree. And I would also like to add just somewhere along there that the reviews and recommendations of the Commission should be going forward from the date of approval and that there will be no retroactive review of any actions.

Thank you.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Mayor Redekopoulos- Great. Thank you for those concise comments. I appreciate that, Council Member Mendoza. That was very efficient. Let me go ahead and go to Councilmember Penelosa.

David PenalozaItem 9

Thank you, Mayor. And I just want to thank Daniel and staff and the City Attorney's Office for all the work that you've been putting towards this. I wanted to say that I am supportive of all the amendments, one through nine. The only thing that I'm not supportive of is I believe that, number two, I think immediate family members should be allowed to serve on the commission and also the the background checks i believe that there there should be some kind of background checks and vetting when it comes to anybody who wants to serve on this commission uh that is it mayor um i agree with everything that's

Phil BacerraItem 9

been said thank you that's even shorter i like those as well um thank you let me go ahead and go to councilmember fan i think she's the only other person that hasn't spoken thanks this will

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

not be short. I don't apologize. Actually, so first, Sonia, I do want to echo Councilman Lopez's comments relating to the list of items that may be received, reviewed, directed. So for example, if you look at Section 2-666 , it lists eight items, and then it has two kind of in the paragraph of the body of C, which doesn't exactly track the language that is located in Section 2-665D, as in David.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

So if we just please make sure that they...

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

I think they do, but they're just kind of like different... I noticed that as the comments went by. So we will make sure that those are consistent.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

Thank you. So since everybody started with some of the comments that you have provided, I'll do that first.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

Relating to Section 6-660 purpose, I am amenable to the change, to the edits by the community or the request to clarify the purpose. And I do like your recommendation that it says, and provide for an independent oversight director the purpose of the Commission is to act through the independent oversight director I think that's great regarding qualifications I've stated this before I've stated it many times I do not support an oversight commission

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

that excludes members of law enforcement whether active or former law enforcement. I wholeheartedly believe that you know we all have our different perspectives in this community and it's all important. You know I understand why we don't want active duty law enforcement officers to serve and that's why we have that five-year cooling off period which is something that again the military the federal government does have but to say that a spouse, a son, a daughter, you know, somebody that you are close to cannot serve on this commission and be objective,

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

I think is going too far. I can say that as someone who is who was formerly a military spouse, and seeing how my husband was a jag and operated in the process, the legal process in the military, really was eye opening and gave me insight into how that process worked. And I think that that's of value. And that's not to say that there will in fact be a member of a family member of a police officer serving on the oversight commission. This is just to say that there is a possibility that they may, if the right candidate comes along and the right council

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

member chooses to nominate them. So I want to reiterate, I do not support that provision exclusion, excluding immediate family members.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

Relating to the background check, so I guess I have some questions about that. I don't know if it's the police chief or somebody. What would a background check do? How would it implicate the practicality of receipt of information or actually doing the work of a commissioner?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

I'm going to defer that, yeah, to the.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

Somebody's, someone in a suit's walking up.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

Hi, Chief.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

Good evening.

Good evening. All right.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

You're too tall.

Okay. The question is how would a background.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

Why are we asking for a background check? What is the purpose of this?

And let's, I think it's important. Thank you for the question, first of all, and I appreciate the opportunity to address the council and the public on this important topic that you're considering.

So, a background can consist of many things, including a full criminal history, right? That is not what we are considering here. A records check would provide you

convictions, it would provide you status on sex registrant status, it would provide you even misdemeanor arrests that involve moral turpitude. And as I've shared in the ad hoc and with others that have asked my opinion, it's important that as you consider doing this that there be, you know, credibility to this board and that it's fair and equitable and embraced both by the community and the police department employees and so to simply take

someone's word that I have never never been in trouble please bring me to the table I think is problematic we want there to be absolute faith and support of the structure both by the community all of the community not a segment of the community the entire community and just as much support by the police employees no one wants to see police employees engage in misconduct that compromises those good hard-working employees and we are talking about the vast majority so specifically your question you know we have to comply with

Department of Justice and our ability to access CLETS information in the police department. It's essential to do our business and to have people that have not gone through a records check minimally access that information can compromise our access to that Department of Justice content. And so our hands would be tied as a police department. So we need to ensure, not someone's word, we need to ensure that folks that are at the table, at least preliminarily, have been vetted.

And again, I've heard the entire council, I've heard public comments, I've had individual discussions with community members. So I understand, and I understand about including folks that are justice impacted, but what we don't want to do is compromise the integrity, even before day one, of the body. And then you also are going to bring in what I believe will be potential legal challenge by folks on the structure. This commission will be hearing highly sensitive, confidential information.

And someone had mentioned about other commissioners going through backgrounds. You know, all commissioners here in the city of Santa Ana used to go through a background. Everyone, every commission.

For whatever reason, that went away, and frankly, I don't know why. If you are to be a bud tender, you're managing marijuana, you go through a background in the city of Santa Ana in order to do that job function. If you're going to give massages to someone, you go through a full background to do that work product in Santa Ana. So the idea is not to do a full criminal history, you know, background like a peace officer goes through, but certainly we want to know, you know, what type of record exists and, you know, do you want to proceed with this individual and consider them for a part of the board.

I think credibility and trust in the platform that you all put together is essential. And we put up safeguards so that the structure is not challenged legally. Then it's, you know, we're right back to kind of score one without that.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

So that's really helpful. I've done CLUTS training. I've had to get, you know, all that fun stuff. Yes. Where do you put the files? So I totally understand that. And I understand doing a ride along, requiring a background check, all that stuff. I've had to do many background checks in my life, working in federal court, being an attorney, et cetera. My question then is, what is the pass-fail, right? Because I do believe in the policy that those who have been through the criminal legal system have a voice also to provide feedback relating to police oversight in the city. So are we looking at, for example,

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

in many cities we have background checks but it's a five years or ten years or something it's stale or you know you're done with probation it doesn't apply anymore what you know because this is something that was requested by the department I want to get a sense of what you were looking at as to someone who doesn't pass a background check you mentioned misdemeanors with moral turpitude you know there's misdemeanor reckless driving or whatever the case might be is it a felony conviction is it aggravate you know some type of white caller crime or you know can you kind of you know expand on that yeah so so I think just to provide

an attorney phrase it all depends we would have to really provide some guidelines for example for a police officer when they apply the post standard they provide guidelines on on what would be a disqualifier but you know some misdemeanors you know require that you're a sex registrant for life we would not know that if we didn't check right and i don't know that we would want that individual at the table your individual call obviously at the end um you know possession of child pornography is is a misdemeanor do you want that individual at the table your individual decisions and

appointment right um what is uh kind of a provision that is still um with the individual is someone on parole, on probation with gang terms, et cetera. Similarly, where you hear the argument that we do not want a police officer family or some nexus, the same can be said for maybe someone who's there who's been immediately, has gone through the criminal justice system and yet they're at the table opining on these sensitive matters.

i i do believe there's absolute room for inclusiveness uh but i think you know i would i would implore you uh to to be very considerate of that um so that there's a uh credibility to the board um and and it's supported by our our community deserve it i know all of you want to make sure that that happens and then the police officers um we don't want this challenged and i think it was said that you know if we if that happens then you know where are we if you know we've if you all have worked on this so hard you know the other thing i if i may add at this

point um you know mr solto has done some incredible work but there's been also police personnel that have worked on this and they've worked on this tirelessly uh and so their input um is important And so I appreciate the questions.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

So that's really helpful for me because I do understand, for example, we know of individuals who've committed felony perjury and election fraud. And I don't know if I'd be comfortable with someone like that serving on a commission, right, when truthfulness is truly important for this commission. So I think I understand the concern. I feel though that it needs to be fleshed out more for me to accept the boundaries of what you're asking for and I think that there's time and room to follow up on that because for example if

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

someone did commit say a felony when they were 21 and it's been 10 years or 15 years and they've you know they they're done with parole probation everything they're done One, I don't think that person should be prohibited from serving on this commission. I think their insight could be very important to the commission. So just, I'm not ready yet to accept this language, but I would like to see staff come back with something more fleshed out for us to consider relating to the background check. And I think that that's also important because, you know, when you're talking about access

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

to documents, I don't understand if someone is actually going to get access to records, but if they're provided records to review at the time, I'm not sure if they have to go through CLTS. So whether you can have procedures that really put up guardrails to that. But again, I would like to see a more fleshed out policy on that issue. Thank you.

Thank you.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

And thank you for your responses. this.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

Regarding the section 2-664 meetings, I agree with my colleagues with adding the city manager or their designee, the police chief or their designee, I think shall be available or shall attend. I think that there might be some practical issues to say that the commission would have to decide in advance if one or both would attend without conferring with each other or having to check in with a clerk beforehand without seeing the agenda. I think it could be just a practical issue of trying to make sure someone's there versus

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

just saying they have to be available. We can just never ask them a question or the commission might never ask them a question. So I would like to keep the shall attend language. The section 2-665, Powers and Duties of the Oversight Commission, Madam City Attorney, I like your recommendation to adding a section M or subsection M to indicate that the policies and procedures of the police department would not be amended to conflict with the ordinance. I think that's a really good kind of solve.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

As to the language to allow the independent oversight director to administer oaths and compel production of evidence, again, I think that's consistent, as you mentioned, with the charter and that we should add it in there. Just to clarify, I think that ensures that what we're all looking for, what the community is looking for, is that we have the strongest oversight body that we can get under the framework that we have now relating to the days for the chief or city manager to respond to provide a report

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

i don't like to put days in the ordinance you know that's not my jam i would like it because 30 days right the way i look at it is we have a meeting today and you have to provide a record 30 days from now that's two weeks to get it into the agenda system and then published a week later. So really you're looking at two weeks. Even with 60 days that could be difficult. I think, would it be possible, I don't know if my colleagues would be open to this, whether it's, you know, maybe we can have a resolution that comes back just regarding the specific number in the second reading, and maybe staff can provide

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

more detailed insight as to what you think is a reasonable amount of time to provide a report or maybe some type of, again, guardrails as, you know, what the timeline is, whether you can request an extension, et cetera. I just don't like having it kind of hard in the ordinance because if we have a situation that comes up, you kind of don't have the flexibility to expand on that. Is that okay?

May I suggest a provision where it's 60 days but could be extended by the Commission? So you give them the ability to extend it without violating the ordinance.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

Yeah, I think I would be okay with that. And obviously that would be under the assumption that the Commission and every party involved would want to be expeditious. And I think that's a fair assumption to have.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

And if you're okay with that, if you think that gives staff enough flexibility, then I don't think we need a resolution. I just don't like concrete numbers. The next issue is relating to mandated reports. I think my colleagues had mentioned a couple different categories to be added to reporting and I think that's great relating to the number of disciplinary recommendations, number of recommendations accepted, as well as reports or recommendations submitted, et cetera. I think, Mr. Mendez, thank you for our discussion and your comments.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

I think another recommendation might be recommendation as to the budget of what the Oversight Commission might need. I think that that's an important aspect because every department kind of looks up as budget, Madam City Manager, you decide what the budget can look like. But if the Commission can give you a recommendation or what they think might be useful based on And over, you know, the independent director, staffing, et cetera, I think that would be a very helpful item.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

And then... I just want to make sure I'm clear. So we do, the recommendation is that the reports that be added are from the council, police chief and manager concerning, and it goes on to say police department, it does have a reference to legislation or budgetary allocation in police department. Would that be sufficient?

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

Yes, I think that would be sufficient. efficient thank you and then the other item was to post it online subject to redaction I think our measure X committee does that too so that's something I believe our chief has implemented for our policy so transparency is something that our city's done for a long time now I guess overall I am very supportive of what we've worked on here and I really appreciate staff the public and our department as well as our colleagues I I think I've learned a lot from all of you regarding this. One, I'm just making sure I capture everything.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

One other item under section 2-665F, it just mentions that the director shall submit a report with findings and recommendations orally or in writing. I do like the edit to make it orally and in writing. I think that not only does that make it in a public setting where it is recorded, but also it is in writing for folks to follow up. You can't really make it miss, you know, it's not lost in an agenda somewhere.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

And I still, I don't think, I'm just saying I have a hard time, and maybe my colleagues will convince me otherwise. But regarding the ride along, I am concerned, and maybe it comes back to the background check issue. Council Member Lopez, I haven't been able to do a ride along, but maybe, Chief, you can clarify that. In order to do a ride along, you need a background check.

It's a records check, yes.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

A records check. How is that different?

So again, a full criminal history background John would include a complete workup on a person's background. A records check is, you know, are you wanted at the time? We want to make sure we don't put someone

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

in the police car that's currently wanted, yeah. Okay, so, and with that, you know, I'm not comfortable with mandating a ride-along at this time because we haven't figured out this issue of the backgrounds check situation or a records check situation that we've talked as a requirement for the commission. So I would want to leave, thank you, chief. So I would want to leave the ride-along requirement as a recommendation or as something that is optional. And with that, I think that completes my comments. Thank you.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Great, thank you, council member.

Phil BacerraItem 9

So I'm going to lean on you a little bit, Madam City Attorney, because I think you guys are keeping score. You've heard all of us, and I certainly appreciate council members who were very rapid with their responses on certain items, because it almost is a checklist. But before I begin just reciting some of my positions on these items, I wanted to thank our PD, because you're right, Chief, we don't include them as much, but we know that your staff did a lot of work on this and with the ad hoc committee and independently reviewing the language and working with the city

Phil BacerraItem 9

manager's office and especially the city attorney's office so you know the good news tonight is that it appears that there is sufficient support for a police oversight resident Commission that's the good news I think you know we we certainly all realize and that's something positive that we all realize as it is necessary, it is such a large part of our budget that our residents should have an opportunity to comment, should have an opportunity to review issues that involve members of the public and the impact that a department has. As you know, we devote close to 50% of our budget to public safety and we have commissions

Phil BacerraItem 9

for all sorts of things. We have commissions for parks and recreation, we have commissions for planning, we have commissions for arts and culture. So it only begs the question that we should have a police oversight commission as well, it being such an important element of our community. So I do, you know, I mean, ideally, what this commission does, hopefully in the future, is it becomes a very dormant, slow commission with very few issues to address. That is the goal, that this commission will one day not be, will not have issues to address.

Phil BacerraItem 9

they won't have incidents to consider. That is really what we're trying to do here is that to improve policies, to improve practices that you know we'll live in a community where our law enforcement will continue to improve to the extent that this Commission just goes away by its own lack of momentum meaning that there are no officer-involved shootings, that there are no questionable incidents. That's really the goal here, that's the spirit of what we're doing. So I do want to thank everybody up here because we realize it's important. You know, this is something that I think the members of the public and residents have wanted

Phil BacerraItem 9

for a very long time, and I think we're doing the best we can. We want to make it as robust as possible. So we know that we have certain guardrails and restrictions that we can't overcome, and I'm glad to see the language that we recommended at the last work-study session embedded here in the version that I'm looking at. But just to go down the checklist of items, Madam City Attorney, so you can get my voice on some of these, I am agreeable to the first point, which has to do with the purpose and mission of this commission. I certainly thank you for including that

Phil BacerraItem 9

and working with members of the public on that.

Phil BacerraItem 9

On the second item, I do think that I will dissent, because it sounds like there is majority support for having somebody who is either a family member or a police officer that may have been retired or away from service for more than five years. And the reason why is this is that, you know, I am a family member of a former police officer. My brother-in-law was a deputy L.A. sheriff who was shot and killed. So I do know that it would, you know, I could serve. I don't know, and my objectivity, I think, would be sound. But I don't know if that's the case for all of us.

Phil BacerraItem 9

And I just think that there are enough layers of police oversight when it comes to internal investigations, when it comes to IA, when it comes to the district attorney's office, when it comes to the attorney general's office, where you have plentiful representation and members of the law enforcement profession to be able to comment on incidents. This was, in my opinion, supposed to be something that was exclusively for residents and exclusively for members of the public. So I understand the arguments on the other side and this is a policy question, it's not a legal question, so we just bring our own lived experiences to this

Phil BacerraItem 9

and more our analytics to what we want to see. So this is one thing that I will deviate from the majority of the members of the council.

Phil BacerraItem 9

But I do agree on the third point, which it appears that although there are some differences of opinion, I've served on a couple of commissions before I came on the council, And I don't recall, and maybe somebody from staff can correct me, but I don't recall ever having a background check, you know, done on me when I served on the human relations back when we had a human relations and on historic resources and on redevelopment in housing. So I don't think we have any background checks for any of those commissions.

Phil BacerraItem 9

And I know that a board, the personnel board, that does review personnel matters and items that involve our city employees, that is a very sensitive board. It is defined in our charter, and it does look at some very sensitive documents and evidence. And so to the extent that they are not subject to a background check, I think that we don't want to, again, isolate this or send a chilling effect for people that may want to serve on this oversight commission. I think that the chief's comments on that are extremely sound.

Phil BacerraItem 9

I think that if this council or future councils want to take on the issue of requiring all commissioners and all board members to be subject to some limited, and again, I struggle with the definition of what's limited, you know, background check, you know, then that's something for another day. But today I'm not willing to go that far. You know, and one of the questions I guess I would pose, not just on the definition of what's a limited background check, but how would we do that with our residents who are undocumented?

Phil BacerraItem 9

Because this council made a decision to allow members who are residents who are not documented to be able to serve on boards and commissions. So I don't know what that would do. I think it's in direct contradiction with that policy decision that was taken some time back. So that brings me I think to whether or not you know the city manager and and the police chief would or their designees would be present at the Commission I think we have to have designees of the city managers there just because who would staff the Commission so that you know that's something that just makes sense that they should be there I think with

Phil BacerraItem 9

respect to the chief or the department I think that should be subject to the commission's request. So to the extent that they are going to definitely have to interact with members of the department or the chief's designees or the chief himself, I think that should be subject to the commission's request. I think five and six, Madam City Attorney, sounds like you all hammered those out. I think the 60 days, given what the city manager herself said, I'm going to take her at her word that 60 days is sufficient. And if she needs or whoever is the city manager, needs additional time, she can go ahead and request that from the Commission.

Phil BacerraItem 9

I don't see any problem with that. I do think that reports of discipline and recommendations for whether it's termination or anything else should be reflected in reports. That should be something provided and made available. So that is something that I would urge us to consider and for us to include. And again, obviously, to put on the website, this commission is supposed to be as transparent as we possibly can make it. So on the ride along, I think, you know, I've been on a ride along. I think it's helpful, but I don't think it should be mandatory. I think it's also something that each commissioner hopefully will take advantage of.

Phil BacerraItem 9

I think the experience is a good one just to see what officers have to experience. But I don't want to mandate that of anybody. I think that there could be issues of people who serve with us who are disabled and may not have access and may not be able to be part of a ride along. So that's something that I am not prepared to support tonight. The final comment I guess is on, you know, what to me is a fascinating, you know, discussion on whether or not this council has the authority to appoint a director.

Phil BacerraItem 9

I would agree with the city attorney and I know sometimes we go back and forth with each other and we Sometimes you know lawyers will disagree But I completely agree with her with respect to how the interaction between our charter The interaction between case law and the interaction with what we intend to do this director is supposed to be a liaison between the commission and And the department and evidence and reports and so we I believe do by extension of the powers vested in this council have the right to appoint somebody and we should and it should

Phil BacerraItem 9

be subject to a public you know to public disclosure it should be done you know here in front of members of the public so when that happens I think that we vest that director with quite you know quite a bit of authority to be able to review the review some of the sensitive information and share it with members of the commission so I certainly think that that is not something that is a legal stretch. I think that's something that would be, that would withstand challenge if it ever was. So those are my, those are my thoughts. I simply want to again thank members of the public who also, you know, said, who made

Phil BacerraItem 9

the comments that this has been very long, this has been a long time coming, not just these past few years that this council has been together because this Council's been together, I think, only a couple of years as it consists today. But many councils before have tried to tackle this, and they just haven't. And I don't want it to be interpreted as something oppressive or critical or punitive on our officers. In fact, I think that the more and more that we look into this, we realize that the whole purpose of an oversight commission is so we can have the best department that we can provide our members of the public.

Phil BacerraItem 9

And so to the extent that we address these issues and we make sure that we have sound policies, sound practices, and really qualified professionals representing us in the department, I think is very, very important. And that's really one of the goals of this commission. So I think it's completely compatible with supporting our officers and making sure that the residents have trust and confidence in the department that we have. And so this is their opportunity. This is their city. These are their funds that we're expending on this. And so there is certainly a role for them.

Phil BacerraItem 9

And I'm very, very glad that we're finally providing that for them because they certainly, it shouldn't just be us. It shouldn't just be, you know, other peers or officers. It should be the residents themselves. And so I want to thank members of the public that worked very hard on this, the ACLU. I want to thank, you know, CHISPA, all the other advocates who took time out of their life, you know, because, you know, we are up here because we chose to be up here. Members of the public do this on a volunteer basis, and they felt strong enough about this that they really made sure that we followed through as a deliberative body.

Phil BacerraItem 9

So that I think are, you know, are my comments, Madam City Attorney. You probably have now a checklist of everybody and everything. And maybe what you could do is you could recite those and we can maybe put those into a motion.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

Okay. So I'm going to just finally go over that and then you can exercise a motion. So I only have one question. We will go ahead and add acting through as proposed. We will not add the language to exclude the sworn officers. I think I had that correct, right? I had a majority that says we won't do that. Yes. Yes. Okay. The background check, we will address it perhaps at another day. We will not add that. We will add that the city manager should staff the commission and the city police chief or his designee shall attend as requested.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

We will add a subsection M to make sure that any future amendments to policies don't conflict with the ordinance. We're going to add that the director may administer oaths and compel production of evidence. We're going to change language from 30 days to 60 days to report and we're going to add unless extended by the Commission. That will give the City Manager an opportunity to make that extension request if necessary. We will also expand the mandated reports as listed and requested. And we will also add the posting of the Commission reports on the website.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

We will also add, and one of these changes is my change, just to clarify that the Director is an at-will position. It may be hired through a contract or appointment as an employee, but they will serve at the will of the Council and they can be removed by a majority vote of the Council. I will also add that the ride-alongs will not be mandatory. I'm kind of asking this as a question. I will insert that there will be no retroactive review of complaints, so this is a moving forward. That was in an original draft but didn't make it into this one. And then I will add that reports shall be given orally and in writing.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

We will put on our list of to-do to work on future provisions for the removal of commissioners to avoid retaliation and we'll address the issue of potential record checks for all commissioners, but we would make that relevant to the jurisdiction of the Commission. So any records, you know, those are issues for the future that we can come back and amend the Municipal Code. What I don't think I have direction for and I just want to clarify are the changes to the recitals that were mentioned by Mayor Pro Tem. I didn't hear consent to make those changes and we will not, I already addressed the write-along issues. we won't do that.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

So that's the only question I had. With those changes you can make a motion.

Phil BacerraItem 9

All right. I think you had your hand up. Council Member Hernandez.

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 9

Yes. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I just wanted to offer my support. Three of my colleagues mentioned not mandating write-alongs. I wanted to just mention that I'm supportive of that. The one area where I just wanted to emphasize is on the powers and duties of the Police Oversight Commission section 2-665 allow complaints to be filed submitted within 180 days of the alleged misconduct by San Antonio police officer or within one year from persons who are incapacitated due to health and or have been incarcerated.

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 9

I would like to see an inclusion for us to include mental health, any physical or psychological trauma, whether the person that is doing the reporting has had access to mental health care or not.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

I would need, and I would need direction from the council on that.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Was that part of, is that new language being added or is that?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

Yeah, and the proposal from the council member is to add that language, but I didn't, because I didn't hear others agree, I wrote that, I didn't write that down as a yes, just as and the recital changes, I didn't hear others agree, so I didn't write that down as a yes.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Do you see a problem with that additional language? What's your opinion, Madam City Attorney?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

You know, I think that if someone comes forward and says that they're making the request for an extension, I think they can make their case before the Commission and all of those things can be considered. But I think to try to get into the specifics, it might be more restrictive. And it might place someone in the category of not wanting their personal business to be out there. So I think if they submit a request and say, I'm requesting that I have the ability to extend this complaint because, you know, I was having a mental health crisis and I was admitted to a hospital.

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 9

So the example is, let's say somebody is jaywalking and an officer shoves them off their bike. and this individual breaks an elbow or shatters a collarbone. There's, of course, the physical damage, which somebody would be hospitalized, potentially not up to a year, but there are those other barriers that do exist, and that's the trauma that happens after police misconduct, where people are afraid to come forward or people, due to the trauma that they experienced, need some time to regroup. I think that a year is sufficient.

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 9

What I'm saying is that I would also like to, in the topic of pertaining to health, also like to see us include people that have not had access to whether it be mental health care or health care in general. I would like to see that be something that is, of course, not mandated. So if somebody is the receding side of police misconduct, the psychological effects of that trauma should be taken into account if somebody takes 10 months to report.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

So I think, so I'm looking at the subsection now. It says due to health. It didn't restrict it, but if you wanted to clarify that, you could say due to mental or physical health. I mean, I say health is both. Health can be physical and mental, but if you want to be absolutely clear, we could add physical or mental health.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

I'm fine with adding physical or mental health.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Councilmember Phan?

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

Can we just not have this problem and just say a year?

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 9

I think that's fair. I think that's great.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

Like, is there a lot, like, I understand the six months in the year, right, the Torts Claim Act has a six month, 10 month kind of, or one year deadline, but the idea that you kind of have to like prove it or not prove it, if we just say a year, then that's a whole year.

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 9

Let's move forward with the year if you're supportive of that language.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

If that is okay.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Is there any, Councilmember Mendoza?

We need to be very careful and cognizant about the mental health issues because there is state law that we cannot dive into personal health because of the HIPAA regulations. So we'll need to be very, very careful. We don't want any lawsuits against the city, that area. So I'm not sure how we can insert that into this oversight.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Yeah, and I think that's where the Council Member's recommendation was maybe just to extend the time because there are statutes of limitations on everything almost. You have a certain window of time and I think a year if it's agreeable to you, Council Member.

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 9

Absolutely. Yes. Thank you, Council Member Van.

Phil BacerraItem 9

All right.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

So you can just strike all that funky language. We'll still put one year if that looks like we do have majority support just to make it

one year.

Phil BacerraItem 9

It looks like you see a lot of nodding heads on that.

Mayor, if I may. Go ahead. I know the Madam City Attorney mentioned that she didn't hear anybody mention anything about the recitals, but would we mind going around just to say whether we do or do not support those revisions? Because, again, I really think that to say that we're doing this because of what happened in 2020 is not accurate, especially when we had members of the community who have been advocating for police oversight say that we've been doing this for 55, 60 years. So I would just like to have my colleagues weigh in on whether they would support modifying

some of these recitals just so that they are more accurate in reflecting the true purpose of why we are at this point today.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

Oh, I was just saying that would be helpful for me if you went through each of your, because I think you had three or four.

Sure. So just sorry to repeat them over, but real quickly. So I wanted to remove the words that come after the words establishing civilian oversight in section A. So essentially eliminating the words including participation in community forums on establishing civilian oversight following widespread protests in 2020 as part of the national movement for racial justice and police accountability. Again, I don't personally believe that that's the reason why we're here at this point. And I'm hoping that my colleagues would support removing that one sentence there.

And then in subsection B and C, I would like to remove the first sentence so that subsection B would, I'm sorry, recital B would be the Santa Ana Police Department and the city council are committed to working together to build trust and improve public safety. AND THEN IN SECTION C, IT WOULD BE THE CITY COUNCIL IS COMMITTED TO EXPLORING WAYS TO REDUCE LIABILITY THROUGH IMPROVEMENTS AND POLICE OPERATIONS THROUGH CONTINUED TRANSPARENCY. THOSE ARE MY ONLY PROPOSED CHANGES.

Phil BacerraItem 9

GREAT. THANK YOU. MAYBE WHAT WE, SINCE THOSE ARE VERY SPECIFIC, WE CAN MAYBE GO THROUGH AND ASK AND JUST KIND OF CANVAS EACH COUNCIL MEMBER. SO I'LL START WITH COUNCIL MEMBER HERNANDEZ.

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 9

RESPECTFULLY, NO.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Councilmember Phan.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

I'm okay with deleting the mention of widespread protests in 2020, but I'm okay with leaving the other two in.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Councilmember Pinielloz.

David PenalozaItem 9

Yes, similar to Councilmember Phan, I'm okay removing the following widespread protests in 2020, but okay with the other two.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Councilmember Mendoza.

Jessie LopezItem 9

I'm fine with all of them.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Councilmember Lopez.

Jessie LopezItem 9

I'm fine with all of it. And leaving the recitals.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Right.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Do we want to, is staff unclear on any of these?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

If I'm interpreting and listening correctly, I think those two were different. I think I heard Mendoza say she's fine with everything that Mr. Becerra recommended. And I heard Lopez saying she wants to leave them. She's fine with leaving them as is. No? Yes. Okay. Was that correct, Council Member Mendoza? Yes. I just want to make sure, Council Member Mendoza, were you wanting to delete as Mayor Pro Tem suggested or do you want to leave them all in as just as Council Member Lopez suggested?

As suggested by Mayor Pro Tem. Okay.

Phil BacerraItem 9

So you're clear on those. I am clear. I'm clear with the recitals being left as is just because I think that it gives context to what, you know, not just, you know, what historically is accurate but also what recently, you know, led many of us, at least for me, it compelled me even more to try to get this done. But so, hopefully you have a count on, you know, on what that looks like.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

I'm looking to the city manager. I think it's going to be like split, right?

I believe there's a majority support for only removing the 2020 comment.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Okay. And everything else remains the same. Good enough. Okay. Before we, you know, get tangled up into more, do we have everything you need to go ahead and draft the ordinance and bring it back to us for second reading, assuming we...

Phil BacerraItem 9

Questions?

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

Just two.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Okay.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

The first clarification is, Sonia, when you were going back through the process of, you know the changes you had mentioned about not allowing retroactive review of items so my concern with that is part of what I see this Commission doing is addressing policies and practices how do we I just want clarification on that when you're saying retroactive review or investigations maybe if it's only limited to investigations can you clarify that yeah and I think I was referring to

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

investigations because what you don't want to have happen and I've seen this happen because I've worked with other cities on these these commissions say there was an incident that's five years old and it was litigated and the case is settled and everything is just done but the community says we don't like the outcome of that you know we think the officer I'm gonna get real about it Let's say that the issue, for example, many years ago where we had officers that were, there was a recommendation for termination in relation to the cannabis raids that occurred, and then the personnel board overturned that.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

Let's just say that someone wanted to revisit that whole thing. I think the question for you would be, is that useful to have done, you know, seven years later? So I think if you're going to, you know, I look at this as you're moving forward. Now, if someone says, look, we have a history of, I don't know, the way our officers treat someone who's jaywalking, just making that up, then I don't think that's an investigation of a specific incident, but that might be something that your independent director would work with the police department to say, yeah, how many, you know, tickets did you issue for this type of thing?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

So I think it's investigations that shouldn't be retroactive. I think they have jurisdiction over other things.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

Got it. So I think that just means that the one year, right, the one year deadline is one year from the alleged incident. So something that happened, say the cannabis raid, it's past the one year. So we're not going back to things that happened, say, before November 1, 2020. Correct. Two, 21, something like that. Okay, I am okay with that. I just needed that clarification. And the second is to clarify regarding qualification 6-662. I just want to make sure that we're all in agreement that current peace officers are

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

not eligible to serve on the commission unless they have proven that they've separated from police force or whatnot for five years, but that we're not prohibiting immediate family members.

MS.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem 9

Correct. That's how I read that.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

Okay. Thank you.

Phil BacerraItem 9

All right. I think that was a good recital of that one. So I think that was a question I had as well. But so we're saying, I think we're all saying the same thing. Any additional?

David PenalozaItem 9

Mayor?

Phil BacerraItem 9

Yes, go ahead.

David PenalozaItem 9

I'll make a motion to approve with everything that's been noted.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Great. Thank you for that motion. Is there a second?

MS.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

I'll second. Second.

Phil BacerraItem 9

We have Councilmember Lopez with the second. We have Mayor, or excuse me, Councilmember Peñalosa with the motion, a second by Councilmember Lopez. Why don't we do this because this is another historic moment. We have a lot of these historic moments that we do roll call votes. Why don't we do that, Madam Clerk, if you will please allow us to do a roll call vote. Again, these things don't happen often. I think just for the record, I think it's a good thing for us to do. So I'll go ahead and allow you to take roll in the council.

Councilmember Hernandez?

Phil BacerraItem 9

Yes.

Councilmember Lopez? Yes. Councilmember Mendoza? Yes. Councilmember Peñalosa?

Phil BacerraItem 9

Yes.

Councilmember Fan? Yes. Mayor Pro Tem Becerra? Yes. Mayor Sarmiento?

Phil BacerraItem 9

Absolutely yes. Thank you, everybody. That is a unanimous vote. Thank you for all the work.

Phil BacerraItem 9

So, wow, we can...

I do have a few announcements. You do?

Phil BacerraItem 9

I know they're going to be brief, but...

All good news. Our Finance and Management Services Agency was awarded the Distinguished Budget Presentation by the Government Finance Officers Association. And this award reflects our commitment to meeting the highest principles of governmental budgeting. And they're rated in four different categories with 14 mandatory criteria. and there were over 1,700 participants in the budget awards program for the fiscal year 22-23 so congratulations to our finance team on that one we also we also are up for we're nominated in three different categories for an award from

the Orange County Business Council they recognize local public agencies and individuals for implementing policies and programs that cut through red tape and eliminate barriers to economic growth. This year the three categories that we're nominated in is number one, building and land reuse and the community revitalization category for the main place specific plan. Sustainable and green development category for our general plan update and leadership and public service category for our general plan update. We don't know if we won it and we won't find out until November 17th, but congratulations

to our planning and building staff for their outstanding work.

And the last one is to help promote our Public Works Agency for urgent sewer street and water emergencies. They now have a 24 seven hotline number that our residents can call. And the phone number is posted all over our website, but I will also give it to you tonight. It is 714-647-3380 and that's an emergency hotline open 24 hours a day for sewer, street and water emergencies. That's all.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Thank you for those comments. Let me bring it back to the council for their closing comments. I'll start with council member Hernandez.

Johnathan Ryan HernandezItem 9

Yes. I just want to thank my colleagues. I know it's a lot of contentious dialogue that we have, but at the end of the day, I respect each and every one of you. and I thank you all for your efforts to ensure that this ordinance that we brought forth today was one that the community can be proud of and something that we as a city council can be proud of. We've made a lot of history in nearly two years and I just thank every single one of you and members of the public who advocated for this oversight commission for all of your efforts. History was made today. Thank you everybody. Have a good night. Thank you for those comments.

Jessie LopezItem 9

Councilmember Lopez. Thank you mayor. Well first happy birthday to my brother and second I saw the notification that the county put out that you know chalk and the other hospital is at full capacity and so I just want to encourage everyone to get the flu shot if they can't. I'm most likely going to go back to wearing face masks just because I don't want to get sick and so stay safe

Phil BacerraItem 9

and healthy. Thank you. Thank you, Councilmember. Councilmember Mendoza. Thank you.

I have several announcements. The first one is that as your representative on the Orange County mosquito and vector control district, I'm going to make sure that we have less mosquitoes in Santa Ana and so I want yes so the first thing on the agenda is I'm going to get a lot of material to distribute at the weekends this weekend's events on downtown to make sure that everybody is cognizant of the things that they can do

to eliminate mosquito breeding in their homes and in the surrounding areas the The rat infestation is still also a problem, so I'm going to have some brochures for you there. And also I'm going to get some mosquito repellent to pass out because we want to be out in the evening and enjoying our neighborhoods and our patios, so you need to protect yourself. And especially, you know, some of these mosquitoes, they do carry the West Nile virus, so we don't want to promote any of those viruses. And I am very happy to present an incredible book

that was gifted to the city of Santa Ana by the agency, by the Orange County Mosquito and Vector Control District. And it was written by one of their staff and it's called Grandmother Mosquito.

It's scary, but it's very informative.

And it was written by Fritz Petropoulos. And the agency gifted our library several books here. So I'm going to leave them here for our library to catalog and to have them ready for our children to start checking out, or the adults. And we're also going to get some for the New Hope Library. Okay, so these are one gift. We have more gifts.

Santa Ana has been incredibly supportive and informative in being active in fighting this mosquito and vector issues in the county of Orange. So I am very happy to say that the city of Santa Ana was presented with an award that says, in appreciation for your outstanding contribution and level of commitment to improving awareness about vectors and the diseases they carry. And here to put somewhere in our beautiful city hall

is this tremendous genuine oak and crystal award presented by the Mosquito and Vector Control. And before you leave tonight, they asked me for photographs of the entire council here and city manager and staff. So we've got to get photos. If that wasn't enough, the agency also gifted us with, I came in at the right place. I attended one meeting and I came away with so many gifts

that our previous representative, Cecilia Aguinaga, has been working on. And so vector control also awarded us with this incredible plaque that is just amazing,

expansive, and this is another genuine crystal, Very beautiful certificate to memorialize and recognize the commitment that the city of Santa Ana has in protecting its residents. And this award says mosquito awareness campaign. We are the most supportive city. And it's presented to the beautiful city of Santa Ana in appreciation for your outstanding and contribution to levels of commitment to improving awareness about vectors and the diseases they carry.

And so after public comments, after your comments today, also we would all of you come down so we can get pictures of all of this. So don't run off.

And so these awards here, they go to you also, the public, for the support that you give us and your understanding and patience in us as the City Council in keeping you safe because not only can we keep you safe by collaboration and you working with us safe from mosquitoes and other vectors but also from the criminal elements. And that is our job. That's why you elected us. And so these awards here are also for you. You come and visit them any time but you cannot take them with you. So that is it. Thank you, Mayor.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Great. Thank you for that, Councilmember Mendoza.

Phil BacerraItem 9

I like those awards. You just scared me when you left one of these on every one of our seats. So those awards look a lot better than this picture. Anyways, Councilmember Peñalosa.

David PenalozaItem 9

Thank you, Mayor. I just want to remind the public that on Sunday it's daylight savings time, so make sure you, you know, reverse your clock an hour. on Sunday and Tuesday is Election Day, so make sure you all vote. And just want to tip my hat off to Public Works Department, Nabil Saba, your whole crew, Bristol Street, those lots, the Memorial Park residents, thank you endlessly. I drove by last night and today, and those lots are spotless and pristine,

David PenalozaItem 9

and the residents on Magnolia are very very happy as well as anybody else who drives down Bristol Street which is basically everybody that lives in the city so thank you thank you thank you for that that it just shows to the residents what the power your voice can do you know if something is not you know satisfying to you or appealing in any way shape or form use your voice and you get it taken care of. So thank you. Warner still working on that one but it will come soon. So thank you Nabil. That's it Mayor. Good night everybody. Thank you for those comments. Council

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

Member Fan. Thanks. There is so much literature on my desk. I didn't know what to do with all this paper. First I'd like to just put in a plug. Kultura. That's a joint collaboration between the parks and rec department as well as our library services I was told by a little bird that it was also supposed to be called cheese made but that was vetoed but it has some really cool information in it just about all of the things our library and parks department has been doing as well as the zoo I just learned that a group of butterflies is called a kaleidoscope so definitely check that

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

out it's available online as well as in print the other item I did want to say is that we finally went on our state water project trip as part of my duties on the Metropolitan Water District Board. It was epic. It was awesome. There were so many young people. All the other water directors didn't know what to do with them because I think it might have been the first time ever we had more than like two people under the age of 30. And it was just really great because we had they were Santa Ana residents. They were interns, folks who work in the city, volunteer with the city and just wanted to be involved in water and engineering.

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

For those of you out there who are actually watching, water is truly the future. There's a lot of jobs, there's a lot of people retiring, and so anyone who's interested in the sciences or interested in water, talk to me, talk to Public Works, talk to our water department, because there are so many opportunities and we need you. We need young people, we need people of color, people from minority communities to be represented in water. The other thing I want to say in the final is Veterans Day is coming up, November 11th. I just want to thank all of our service members, our veterans, those who are named, unnamed,

Thai Viet PhanItem 9

and their family members, those who have supported them in our community. As I mentioned before, I was a military spouse. My husband is a veteran and while he was never deployed into an active war zone I do understand the difficulties that many families spouses and just friends supporting our veterans and what our veterans go through so thank you for their service Councilmember Mendoza thank you for your service and please have a wonderful and safe Veterans Day weekend thank you thank you Council

member uh mayor pro tem thank you uh just wanted to uh remind everybody that i'll be even though it's the middle of campaign season i'm still going to be hosting my uh monthly community office hours on this saturday november 5th over at uh george upton all-access park on the north end of carl thornton park that'll be at 10 a.m the night before that though just less than a mile away from thornton park uh segestrom high school is going to be hosting saint margaret's in the first round of of the CIF football playoffs. So we've got three schools in, three Santa Ana schools in the CIF playoffs playing this week,

two of which I'm very happy to say are in my ward. So we've got Sagerstrom playing St. Margaret's. Unfortunately, Valley's gotta travel all the way up to Victor Valley. And then we've got our Saints, Santa Ana High School playing Fillmore here at the Bull.

And my only other comment tonight is make sure you vote. Thank you, goodnight.

Phil BacerraItem 9

Thank you for those comments. Let me just begin by saying, you know, I want to thank everybody who had a role in tonight's night. We adopted a historic piece of public policy here at the city council level. Thank you for all of your indulgence and your patience. I know it was a lot of work on behalf of everybody who had a role. I know I was contacted earlier and said, you know, this might be one of those moments for a ceremonial signing, so let's have that conversation later. I do want to thank Bertha, Mary Jane, and especially Victor Mendez for coming and spending the evening with us.

Phil BacerraItem 9

They represent so many more people because of age, because of disability, that couldn't join us tonight. But, you know, Council Member Lopez and I, because it is in her ward, and I'm talking about 2222 East First, we're experiencing a very drastic rent hike as high as 10% and that is a senior affordable housing development that is new newly constructed and it was that that excessive rent increases rent increase was very outside the industry standard so I want to give a shout out to our housing division especially Judson Brown who took time out of his day

Phil BacerraItem 9

to work with our staff, work with the principals and owners at that site, and Supervisor Foley for helping us coordinate a meeting. But you did a heavy lift to the extent that the owners decided to retract that and begin with a much more reasonable adjustment in rent. So thank you for your advocacy, everybody. Please give everybody our best back at 2222 Metro East. I do want to give a shout out to somebody who's very special to me, and she brings two other special people with her. My wife, Eva, is in the audience with her brother, Romelio, and her sister, Carolina. Gracias por venir a todos ustedes.

Phil BacerraItem 9

And they don't come often, but you came to a good one. Thank you all for joining us and being here. I love you all. I want to say, you know, we're coming upon, you know, a week away from elections. What was really, really sad for me is during the primary in June, Santa Ana had about a 22-25% voter turnout. That means that three out of four people eligible to vote didn't. And so if we can improve those numbers, let's make sure we do. It doesn't matter who you vote for. Just have your voice heard. This is something that's so critical and precious to all of us is that you know

Phil BacerraItem 9

the importance is that we at least have a role in the decision-making and who represents us at the federal state county and local levels so if you know anybody who hasn't turned in their ballot please do so if anybody needs any help let us know we will make sure that we find a way that people get their votes in the ballot boxes so with that I want to say don't forget this weekend this Dia de los Muertos. I know that we're having Noche de Altares. Thousands of people will be coming into our downtown celebrating. I know we still have some work to do in the downtown,

Phil BacerraItem 9

making sure all our merchants are aware and are on board, and I know staff is working diligently and responsibly on that. But with that, I want to wish you all a good night. Thank you. We are adjourned.

Thank you.