Read the December 3 meeting.

All right, if you can all please stand for the Pledge of Allegiance. I'm going to call this meeting to order. Ready, begin. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. If you can remain standing, we have Bob Barnett going to give us our invocation this evening, our police chaplain.

Lord God, we begin this evening by inviting your presence to fill this place. Not many days ago, Lord, we celebrated Thanksgiving, and we have many reasons tonight to be grateful. We're grateful for our city, our city workers, our people, the businesses, Lord, our city council, our mayor, and our first responders, Lord. we will always be grateful for the way that you work in and around us lord bless this night bless those to be honored this night and please lord in the days ahead as we look to this holiday season increase our faith our faith in you and in each other increase our hope that we can smile always

at the future and most importantly lord increase our love that we truly can be one people under

God indivisible. In the name of the Lord, amen. Thank you. You may be seated.

I want to ask folks here from the Orange County High School of the Arts, I don't know who's here representing that entity. Oh, here he is, right next to me. He's way ahead of me. Miguel, just turn to your right. Turn to my right, and I see a wonderful individual who, if you've ever seen him sing or play the piano,

you know Ralph O'Basic can do it all and he leads the Orange County High School of the Arts and I know I think they're gonna perform for a moment but before they do let me just say that this is 20 years since we embarked on a crazy journey to say let's bring OSHA from Los Alamitos to Santa and it took about I don't know two and a half years or so from beginning to end because first we kind of got in a car we drove around couldn't find anything we went around Ford Street looked some more couldn't really find anything we were

looking for like lots of land is a fourth densest city in the country we don't have a lots of land we've got lots of other things but not lots of land and then we started thinking out of the box and say me you can go vertical well where Where do you go vertical? Well, we found a building on North Main Street. Then we had to convince this guy named Mike Hara, who's also a little bit crazy, that maybe it would be a good thing to do to go ahead and build this high school and build it for the High School of the Arts.

And then the meetings began. I remember meetings at my home with board members from Los Alamitos crying because they were going to lose the school. I remember telling them, look, you're not losing the school, you're going to grow the school. It's going to go to St. Ann, it's going to flourish, it's still going to be your baby. Forever it's going to be your baby, but it's going to graduate. It's going to be a bigger, better entity. And now there's like 350,000 square feet, a whole lot of square feet along Main Street and the whole area that's part of the High School of the Arts.

There is an OSHA family. OSHA is the acronym for the High School of the Arts. And by that I mean people that graduate from OSHA never really leave OSHA. You know, they have friends, they go to college, they go into different aspects of the arts industry. And there's a whole network of people out there that help each other, that love each other, that are growing together. And it's become such an amazing thing because almost no matter where you are in Orange County and beyond, somebody knows somebody that goes to OSHA. Oh, yeah, you know, my son's kid goes there or somebody at work that they know goes there.

It's just become such, you know, they're ambassadors. They're ambassadors for the city, for the general community. And it's just, you know, so wonderful to see. I know that, I don't know how Ralph does this, but I think they have a 100% graduation rate. So if you enter OSHA, you can't, like, not graduate, because Ralph will not let you. And then of those that graduated, something like a 98% going to, you know, higher education. So I don't know how Ralph does that either, but he does.

And then there's some other whereas's here, Ralph, but maybe let me just let you say a few words, because I can't believe it's been 20 years. I'll tell you, this was definitely not a part of my plan, because you can't plan a lot of things, especially when it involves your kids. but after elementary school where they went to Santiago Elementary here in San Ano over on Baker all three of my kids chose to go to OSHA they were all fortunate to enter and they all had an amazing experience there and I know that as I've met other parents and other kids that have gone there there's a real beautiful spirit

around that high school and around that institution and really it's now from I guess 7th grade through 12th grade. So once you got them, Ralph, you hold on to them for a long time and you really try to set the students in a good direction. So before I present you a proclamation, I want to turn things over to you for a moment, please.

Thank you, Mayor Pulido, City Council. It's hard to believe it has been 20 years. I remember about 21 1⁄2 years ago when I got a call from Mayor Pulido saying, we don't know why Los Alamitos doesn't want you there anymore. we want you in downtown Santa Santa Ana and accepting that invitation was the best thing we ever did we were a small after-school program 400 students in Los Amidos we now serve over 2200 students from over 120 cities from across Southern California over 200 of those students being Santa Ana residents from right here we're thrilled to be part of the Santa Ana community

you give me a lot of credit but it is my amazing staff my team I want to recognize a couple people my executive vice president Taryn Schaefer if you'd stand my creative director who's responsible for so many of our productions if you to stand and I would be remiss to not introduce the smarter more attractive dr. Opeysik that actually took a hiatus from her career to help us open the school a few years 20 years ago dr. Sherry Opeysik so thank you mayor Pulido thank you city council for investing us and believing in us it is such an honor to be part of the Santa Ana community one more shout out I'd

also there's so many Santa Ana police officers here I want to thank the Santa Ana police officers for providing our security it's makes our families feel so safe that you're here and you're involved in our SRO as part of your community as well so thank you we're thrilled to be part of the Santa Ana community 20 years the best is yet to come mayor Palito thank you thank you and with that

Are you going to come up? Why don't you come on up? And as they're coming up, I think they're going to do, I assume they're going to do a Christmas. Of course, we're going to ring in the season. We're going to ring in the season. So let's let them come in and ring in the season. I don't know if we want the city council to participate in any way. Maybe we do a photo as soon as they're done. You can sing, Phil. Just keep the microphone away. but let's let them sing and after that once you come on down we'll take a

Christmas photo with OSHA. Go ahead Ralph. So this is selected performers from Montage our our community premier community performance group to ring in the holiday season they're going to sing the world for Christmas. Go ahead and

sing and then we're going to take some pictures please go ahead.

It's the night before Christmas and all through the house. Not a creature is stirring, not even a mouse. The stockings are hung by the chimney with care. But hopes for St. Nicholas I wish I could share. I am new to this world, I arrived here this morn, to this beautiful planet, though beat up and torn.

I don't need a gift, need no more than I've got, hear the unspoken wish from a tiny, tiny talk.

I only want the world for Christmas, the blue-green forever-turning world for Christmas. Nothing more, nothing less I want it for keeps and I promise to share So that everyone who wants can cuddle and care I only want the world for Christmas

The blue-green forever-turning world for Christmas. To restore, to repossess, please make it last. My fate is in your hands. Oh, give me a present for the future. You could follow your heart but you follow a wind

And fill up your stockings way over the brim Ignoring the signs in your frail crystal ball You wish away, wish away, wish away all The moon on the breast of the new fallen snow Gives the luster of midday to objects below Why your eyes won't see when they're given all this life

I wonder, I wonder this very special night I only want the world for Christmas The blue-green forever-turning world for Christmas To restore, to repossess Please make it last My pain is in your hands

Oh, give me, oh, give me Oh, give me, oh, give me Oh, give me a present for the future

Ralph, I'd say a little something else. I'll present this to you. I want the council come down and I don't know if you guys can get any closer together to stay in this area, but let's take a photo. So this is for the congratulations for the 20th anniversary here in Santa Ana. And as you say, the best is yet to come, but it's been a fabulous 20 years, Ralph.

Thank you, Mayor. Thank you very much. While we get in here, take you toward the front. Ralph, you have to be.

Come on. Council in front, please. Ladies and gentlemen, in the back, can I please stand up? Thank you. Side a window, and now.

Ready?

One, two, three. One, two, three.

Thank you. Thank you.

Congratulations. Congratulations. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much.

Congratulations. Thank you. Oh.

Please take it.

If I can have the members from the Senate and Police Department, Explorer post 238. Please join me up here.

Thank you for joining us. This evening I'd like to recognize the Santa Ana Police Explorers from post 238. They recently competed in the Orange County Law Enforcement Explorer Advisory Association competition. And what was that? Third place, correct? Third place out of 50 in the region. Yes, a round of applause.

I'm a big fan of these programs because they're similar to the ROTC programs that we have in high school also. So whether you're in an ROTC program or you are in the fire explorer or the cadet corps or the police explorers, they all have one thing in common that they teach and that's leadership. Leadership and all of the traits that come along with it. So self-discipline, all those programs, promote people, the individual to do well in school, to work as a team, and to learn to be a leader. Get your step up.

You have to see it and step into those roles to learn from these and also learn from your mistakes and learn from the good things and the bad things that come along. Also make it a tough call. If there's one of the advisors can come forward and speak a little bit about, talk to us, share about the competition.

Thank you. If you can share a little bit about this.

Thank you, Mayor, City Council. Something that this guys aren't recognized for is all the work that goes on before the competition. So in only two months, these police explorers dedicated over 100 hours of their own time to practice in 14 different events that range from a bunch of different calls for service that we'd respond to normally in the field. So it's on their dedication and all the time that they put in with us, myself and my partner Albert Dejo, that shows their dedication to not only themselves but to the department and keeping up the tradition of Santa Ana Police Department.

So a huge honor to work with these young men and women. And definitely can't say anything but good things for them. Thank you very much.

Chief Valentin, if you could come forward and say a few words.

Thank you very much, Mayor Pro Tem and City Council, for this recognition. As Mayor Pro Tem said, these Explorer programs are vital to pathways, not only in law enforcement, but really in career development in general. And so we're very proud of this team. They competed, as was said, with 50 other teams throughout the county. They did achieve third place in one of the practical apps, but I believe they were first in another area as well. And so, again, can't say enough about the performance, the skills. They also sing, by the way. Are you ready? I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding.

I want to acknowledge also Commander Jeff Smith, who is here, is actually retiring later this month and has stayed diligent in his dedication and oversight of the entire Explorer post. Sergeant Sanchez, who is also an advisor and the officers that are here as well, they serve as critical advisors and mentors for our Explorers. We have a total of 30, and we're accepting applications for more. So if you're interested, please contact one of the officers here, and we can get you in the right path. So thank you again. Appreciate all the support.

Thank you, Chief Valentin. And thank you, everyone, the commander and all the officers, the sergeant also involved in making this a successful event, successful competition. Salmon and Anna always represents very well, and I have some certificates of recognition here, so I'm going to pass these out.

So on behalf of the Mayor and City Council, if you could please accept those certificates of recognition, and we're very proud of all of you for all that you do and the officers for your dedication to the success of this program. You can get a round of applause for these individuals.

Let's take a quick photo.

Thank you, everyone.

Thank you, Mayor Pro Tem. Now I will leave Councilman Iglesias as next, so we'll yield the floor to her.

Good evening, everyone.

Okay, so it is my pleasure to give a recognition to a longtime friend. I still know her as Tita, council member from the City of Orange, and also my colleague when I used to work for the County of Orange. That's where I met Tita. I think that was in the early, I would say late 90s and early 2000s. But Tita, if you could come over here, I'm going to share a little bit about you, and then feel free to add anything that I've missed.

anything okay so I'm gonna tell you a little bit about Tita she's no stranger to Santa Ana Teresa with track holiday this myth attended modern-day high school pursued a degree in social work and graduated with her master's degree in 1992 shortly thereafter Tita began her first social worker job with Catholic Charities of Orange County serving as a director of the Colombian house a 24-hour residential home for 12 children with special needs Tita then moved on to work for the Orange County Health Care Agency in Santa Ana as a therapist and social worker,

but it was not long before that she was recruited back by Catholic Charities of Orange County in 2006 to lead a $3.5 million five-year grant focused on keeping low-income families together by teaching communication, parenting skills, and stress management, and was eventually named the Executive Director in 2009. That's a great accomplishment. Founded in 1976, on Spurgeon Street, Catholic Charities of Orange County offers one of Orange County's largest immigration and citizenship program,

emergency assistance to families and seniors, food distribution, mental health counseling, camp recreation for adults and children with special needs, and also the CalFresh Healthy Living Program, which promotes food acquisition and good nutrition. Most recently, in partnership with the City of Santa Ana, Catholic Charities of Orange County has introduced Safely Home in Santa Ana Eviction Prevention Program, which protects Santa Ana residents from evictions through emergency grant funding. This week, TIDA is retiring after 45 years of service to our community, including 27 years working right here in the City of Santa Ana.

so Tita thank you for taking a special interest in our city and thank you for all that you do my friend

well I want to I'm sorry with my back to you I guess I'll face you first of all I want to thank you servant leaders of the City Council of the City of Santa Ana I've known some of you for a long time but haven't seen you for a long time and I'm very, very grateful for this recognition. I want to tell you that Catholic Charities is so very proud to have been of service here in Santa Ana since June 3rd of 1976. We opened our agency on Spurgeon Street. Of course, I was a young child at the time and don't recall this, but

we are honored to be part of the thriving, gracious, colorful, beautiful, multicultural city of Santa Ana and I'm very very grateful I want to say and thank you City Council for choosing us for your safely home in Santa Ana eviction prevention program along with the Salvation Army of Santa Ana we are most honored especially Councilwoman Iglesias I salute you as being the only woman on the council I know what that feels like and it's very proud to represent and I thank you for this recognition I am very humbled by your kind gesture and we thank you for your graciousness to all the things you cooperate with us citizens

and government alike for all of those many people that we serve at Catholic Charities of Orange County and with that I wish you blessed holidays to you and your families and of course let's always keep in our prayers the good people of Santa Ana and those who lead her thank you very much god bless

so before she goes we have a certificate of recognition with weeds in recognition of your outstanding contributions to the community and it's stated and it's on behalf of all of us here on the council thank you

thank you

Now we have our next presentation.

and we have Council Member David Pinaloza representing the great district number four.

Two.

There you go. The better district, number two.

Number two.

And it's Pinaloza, and go ahead with your presentation, please. First it was the last name. Now he's putting me in that district. Now at least I got the last name right.

David PenalozaItem —

Good evening, everybody. I'd like to welcome former defenseman from the Anaheim Ducks, 2007 Stanley Cup winning team, Mr. Kent Huskins. Kent Huskins here and his wife, Bree, did you bring the wife? No? Opened Huskins Coffee Company in July of 2018. And I believe when we first met around that time, he told me about it. We met at the zoofari over at the Santa Ana Zoo, and he said, I opened the coffee shop. I was like, cool. I'm a candidate for city council. I was like, what issues did you see coming across, you know, opening a business in Santa Ana? And he just said,

David PenalozaItem —

well, it took me about a year to open up a coffee shop. And to me, I was just like, well, you know, that's a long time for, then just kind of to put into perspective how slow the process was to get a business up and going. But I wanted to recognize him initially for his grand opening and for choosing Santa Ana as a look as a city so you know be home to to his coffee shop conveniently located in the 1901 building in Santa Ana our first Street the coffee bar offers free parking for its customers which is always a plus Huskins sources its organic beans from royal coffee and

David PenalozaItem —

Portland sustainable harvest and roast them on site for an outstanding product correct they're roasted on site. Is it every morning?

He can get a little closer to you, Council Member Pignon.

David PenalozaItem —

He's a little far away. He's a little shy.

David PenalozaItem —

Just pretend there's a hockey puck flying towards your face and you could be more present. Partnered with native Santa Ana resident and coffee expert Megan Houston, Huskins Coffee has become a local favorite. In his second career, Kent has fulfilled the dream of owning his own business and has done so with the support of a great team. Huskins Coffee Company demonstrates the adoration Kent has for quality coffee and the care for his customers through the products he provides. Today we recognize Huskins Coffee Company and thank Kent for bringing quality products through a quality business for residents to enjoy.

David PenalozaItem —

The one complaint that I do have is that the times that I've gone, it's always closed. I never understand when the hours of operation are, but I have had it, and it's good coffee, so I highly recommend it. I encourage everybody to support local Santa Ana business. And if that, would you like to say any words? Sure, yeah. Please. Yeah.

Well, thank you, Council Member Petaloza and City Council, for this honor. Yeah, just very, very excited to be here operating. Thanks. in Santa Ana my wife Bree as was mentioned couldn't be here this evening she's chasing our two crazy kids around but so yeah definitely speaking on behalf of her as well and many thanks from us to the city of Santa Ana and all the citizens and the great people we've had a chance to meet so far and also a special acknowledgence to my parents who are visiting from Canada right now

So we're here for Thanksgiving and a nice couple weeks here. But yes, thank you to everyone. We really love being a part of Santa Ana and love doing anything we can to contribute to the betterment of the community and just getting to know the great people. So thank you, everybody. Thank you.

I guess you could hang up at your office or shop.

David PenalozaItem —

Yeah, yeah, perfect.

Thank you.

David PenalozaItem —

Do you want to get a picture?

Yeah.

David PenalozaItem —

Thank you, sir.

Thank you for that. Now we have Councilman Vince Armiento. I believe he's recognizing Godina's Fundamental High School and Saddleback High School, their counseling programs. You've got quite a crew here. Go ahead, Councilman Vince Armiento.

Thank you, Mr. Mayor. And I want all the counselors and staff from Godina's and Saddleback to come join me up here, as they're coming up here. So Kent was just talking about Huskins Coffee. You know what Ward that coffee shop is? Ward 1. So, yeah, of course. We've got good quality stuff there. And he's a duck. So that's even better. But I've got a couple of folks here that aren't hockey players, but they're just as rough and tough. their council their counselors over at Godina's fundamental high school and Saddleback High School and they have met a very very lofty goal and I'm not sure

Bo Menchaca is Bo here did he make it he's not all right well I just want to give a shout out to Bo because he's the one that brought you folks to my attention and you know and I know he's a hero in all our hearts because Bo does so much work throughout the city and just loves students all over the all over the district so so who's heard of the race to submit right so neither had I race to submit is a is a statewide initiative that encourages schools across California to motivate all their high school seniors to submit what's called a free application for federal student application and and the

California Dream Act application and basically what this is is it's an effort to make sure that students get financial aid when they go off to college. And for many of us, and I know I was a Pell Grant recipient, a Cal Grant recipient, many, many loans, and had it not been for those efforts, I mean, I wouldn't have gotten through my first year in college. And so I know many of our students in San An are in the same position where without financial aid, without these grants and programs, we can't really go very far. So there was this challenge that was made by the state of California to make sure all our seniors submit.

But what's great about this effort is that Godina's, in helping their students, the administrators, teachers, all the college partners and counselors, the folks up here, Godina's came in second place in the entire state. Second place.

Second place.

And not far behind them was Saddleback, an eighth place in the entire state. So a shout-out to them.

And if many of you don't remember what these financial aid applications look like, when I went to college, I mean, they were like maybe two or three pages long. Now they're like booklets, right? So they're really, really extensive. They're complicated. They're really difficult to navigate. And you really do need somebody who understands it to be able to help out. And these folks took time during their lunch, after school, any time they had available, because they had to continue doing other work in addition to what they did to help support the students here. So that makes their achievement even that much more valuable.

But it really helped because they made students' dreams realized. Without this aid, a lot of these students wouldn't have been able to go far. so they really are really really special folks in the lives of not just the students but of the parents because many of our parents in Santa Ana haven't gone to college and when they see these applications before them it's daunting and it's discouraging so you folks made it you know really really accessible for your students to be able to go and as somebody who's had to fill out many of those applications you know my hats off to you because they're not easy and They're not simple.

So I want you all to come up here, and I just want to mention your names really quickly, and I know not everybody was able to make it, but let me just go ahead and mention from Godina's Fundamental High School, Jesse Church, the principal, Felipe Samudio, the assistant principal of counseling, Jimmy Bravo, Jimmy Bravo, higher education coordinator, Alba Valenzuela, Elizabeth Castro, Michelle Holguin, Dr. Veronica Chavez, Matthew Hall. That's the Godina's team. Let's give them a big round of applause.

And the Saddleback team consists of Assistant Principal Gerardo Correa, Higher Education Coordinator Edith Cruz, Counselors Jessica Aguirre, Stephanie Sachs, Fabiola Quesada, Nancy Villarreal. So all of them, all of them are just incredible people. And, you know, we want to thank both teams for not only supporting our San Antonio youth in day-to-day duties, just making sure that they get through classes, make sure that they graduate and do good things and understand what's available for them, but also assisting them in attaining valuable resources aimed at college admissions.

So I just wanted to bring them up here because there's so many stories about people succeeding and doing well. Sometimes we never see these faces of people that change their lives. And I can remember counselors and mentors that were real critical in my life that I still recall, that when I was discouraged and didn't know who to turn to, there was a friendly face, a friendly voice, and somebody who was instructive, and all of them fit that mold. So can one of you come up here and kind of talk to us a little bit about the program?

David PenalozaItem —

Councilmember Sarmiento?

Yes.

David PenalozaItem —

Can I just say something really quick? Can you give a shout-out? Yeah, I just wanted to give a shout out because I am a prime example of the work that they've done. Miss Stephanie Sachs, I'm going to call you out. She was my high school counselor at Saddleback High School. And I believe it was the fall of 2006 where I started applying for colleges. And I do remember that at the time the application was about 60-some dollars, if I recall. I don't know how much it is now. but I remember asking my mom mom I need you know 60 bucks for this application she thought I was crazy she was like $60 for an application and it was miss

David PenalozaItem —

Stephanie Sachs that helped me along with mr. Munoz at the time gather that it was I don't know where she got this voucher from but they were apparently out and she helped me and I remember it was like 6 p.m. and we're at the higher ed center and along with her you know they helped me with these applications she probably doesn't remember because of the hundreds of students she's helped. She did remember me because she, you know, she's so, you know, they do a lot of great work and I'm happy to recognize them along with Council Member

Sarmiento. Very nice. Thank you, Council Member. Thank you.

So, Stephanie, we have you to thank or you to blame, right? I don't know. But do you want to say a few words? Have you guys chosen a spokesperson? Bravo. Bravo, come on. Bravo.

The mic is yours, sir. Okay.

Well, thank you all for the recognition. Just a little bit about what he was mentioning, too. It's just a lot of work that goes into filling out the financial aid applications and all that. Obviously, the goal is to get as many students into college, and so the financial aid application obviously helps with all of that. I mean, this is just a small sample of all the great counselors that we do have in Santa Ana, and we definitely need more counselors. and obviously it's a whole community at the school. It's not just our counselors but also our teachers, our administrators like Mr. Church and Mr. Eddie Bustamani.

I apologize and I do know him pretty well. So it's people like them that make a big difference. And also our partners, our community partners like Santa Ana College, UC Irvine, Cal State Fullerton and some of the other teachers and community members that come in. We also had people from, like, the Boys and Girls Club to come in to help us in filling out these applications. So, again, you know, we definitely look forward to this application season. It ends March 2nd, and so we want to make sure that we are hopefully topping our in the state again. And thank you for having us here tonight again. Thank you.

so I've got two certificates of recognition here for Godina's fundamental high school and Saddleback high school in recognition of your outstanding contributions to the community and placement on the 2019 race to submit leadership board I just want to say thank you for also making sure that you know those that are eligible apply for the dream act so that's something real special so thank you for doing that let's take a quick picture let's give them a big round of applause. Thank you.

Council Member Sarmiento, as you're doing that, I now have to thank Jimmy Bravo, who's an outstanding counselor at Godinus, because he helped my oldest boy get into Stanford, and my youngest boy right now is in application mode, so congratulations, and thank you, Mr. Bravo, everybody else, and Principal Church who's also here from Godinus High School.

Thank you.

Thank you.

here today, but I know there's hundreds and thousands of them that are now better off because of their efforts. So thank you for all you do. So now let me bring our attention back, and let me just ask the city attorney, is there anything to report out of closed session, please? Mayor,

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

council members, and members of the public, we do have some reportable action. In the case of Laura and John Franks versus the city of Santa Ana, we were given direction to settle the case in the amount of $300,000 by a 4-3 vote with our council members Solorio, Penelos and Iglesias voting no. We also were given direction to extend a tolling agreement by a unanimous vote of the City Council and that is all the reportable action

that I have. Thank you for that Madam City Attorney. I now I'm going to turn to the consent calendar and note that we have item 11A as a first item on our consent calendar, and I know we have speaker cards, so I'm going to go and indulge members of the audience on this first item, and after that we'll bring it to council for

consideration. Mr. Mayor, if you could also pull 20B as in boy. Well, right now we haven't pulled. There's a bunch of others that we're going to pull. I'm just noting that 11A is a first item, so let's just get into that. Before we go with anything else, we'll come back and we'll pull the rest of the consent calendar this is just the first item on the consent councilor iglesias already gave me a couple items so i'm not going to go into that right now let's just listen to these speakers and and we'll go from there and we'll get you to where you have to go

asap on behalf of the city councilor sarmiento is going to be driving tonight to uh to san diego so we're all cognizant of the fact that he's volunteering his efforts. For a water conference, not for a water conference. Not fun at a hotel. He's going to go talk serious water business. And I think so is Council Member Solario, by the way. Except you're leaving in the morning. He wants the traffic and the rain and everything else.

I think the Council Member has an earlier role.

There you go. All right. First speaker on 11A, Mike Rothenhess, followed by Ellen Calloway.

Mr. Mayor, I think that was Mark Rothenberg.

Go ahead, Mark.

And Lisa Gantz, you would be after Ellen. and then Angel Barnes would be the following speaker.

Start the clock again. Don't start until you start speaking. Go ahead, Mark.

Mr. Member of the Council, thank you for hearing from us again. I know this is the last thing, frankly, you'd like to discuss tonight. It may come as a surprise. Obviously, we're very appreciative to those Council members, Mr. Mayor, yourself, of course, included, that voted with the neighbors against the 25-25 project. And we also want to thank Councilmember Iglesias. I think, frankly, you've gotten a bad rap on this, because we do recognize that you were instrumental in getting the density on this project dropped.

Now, I watched this hearing again in preparation for my land use law class, as an example, and I paid close attention to what each of you said. and Councilman Iglesias you were surprised at the beginning of the meeting because the council's direction was to send this back to the neighbors send the developer back to the neighbors along with staff to see if we could at least all walk away a little bit unhappy but make incremental improvements to the project and you were surprised that that didn't happen Councilman Solorio you got some concessions from the developer at the last meeting you got some fencing and the other comments

that we received, Councilman Penaloza and in addition, Councilman Sarmiento, where the heck have you folks been on other projects? Why can't you be more helpful? And so to that end, we wanted to be more helpful. We went through the development agreement, and unfortunately in a project like this that has gone through so many changes and evolutions, I'm very sympathetic to your city attorney and to council and to staff because the development agreement didn't didn't track all of the changes in the project. There are a number of missed opportunities and

vague language in the development agreement that really, if you're not inclined to change your vote, and we beg you to do so, if you're not inclined to change your vote, and you're not inclined to put this forth to a referendum of the public, at a minimum we would ask you to defer this for a month and do what the councilman suggested, which is to send this back to the neighbors. And I'd like to just focus on a handful of points there's a financial point council and Soloria we would ask you to look at that point is why is the developer getting two years of extension after four hundred and sixty thousand dollars a year of lost

revenue and the developer to get those two years only pays a hundred thousand dollars that strikes us as being horribly unreasonable the developer is allowed to phase this project he can build it take the time that he wants he can build it in stages any way he wants that's why we have a big mound of dirt by the way in the middle of downtown that can happen here now I'm sure the developer will tell you I'm gonna get a building permit tomorrow but if the economy crashes if there's a problem with financing it happens all the time these projects stall out there are provisions with regard to the city

attorney approving covenants conditions and restrictions I don't think your charter allows for that but even if that were the case even if that were the case they should there's a provision that says that if the city just doesn't respond if it gets lost in the mail they're automatically approved now when I negotiated development agreements we would never allow for that because mistakes happen you don't take silence as acceptance or approval of a document that's been sent to you that's a huge problem and finally we would ask you to look at the issue of a pedestrian bridge there's a requirement in this

development agreement that the developer provide art valued at a half a percent of construction cost development agreement doesn't tell you how to come up with that number, but we would ask that as part of a discussion, if this were to go back for a month, to try to take some of the arrows out of our quiver, to try to address some of our concerns, to talk about a pedestrian bridge. Think about all the museum traffic that's going to be going back and forth across Main Street and how dangerous that is. Thank you. You're out of time. Please

conclude. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I appreciate it. Other representatives will be speaking about other

issues but we appreciate your consideration thank you mark ellen followed by lisa followed by angel barnes followed by dave fratkin good evening mayor and council members i'm mrs ellen calderway

i'm your constituent i'm a santa anna voter and i'm here tonight to object to the inclusions of 11a 1 and 2 and the consent calendar on tonight's agenda and i also object to the final adoption of these ordinances by council on the second reading without further informed discussion consent calendar really needs to be reserved for routine items and with due respect I think the one thing we can all agree on is that these have not been routine and your final votes on the adoption of the development agreement and zoning amendment for tonight they're not routine they should

not be enacted by a single motion without further discussion so I'm requesting that council pull those two ordinances from the consent calendar for further discussion before voting now what might inform your voting that you haven't already heard well mr rothenberg and my other neighbors have compiled a really helpful document highlighting and summarizing their key concerns and i think that if you take the time to review that and provide the city staff and our city attorney with another opportunity to review the concerns

presented in that document and then reconvene in January 2020 to make a final informed decision will all be in a better place now the development agreement along with legal objections by a number of attorneys who have spoken who have objected should be evaluated during that one month deferral city attorney planning director should be given an opportunity which candidly I I don't think they've been given before, to clean up a number of problems or ambiguities in the document so the staff would have the opportunity to obtain meaningful concessions for the city that appear to have been overlooked. This is not the best possible deal.

What other information might be of value to you? Well, if you still feel that you have not gotten the pulse of the community, I implore you to let the voters decide. Send the ordinances to a citywide referendum. If you're truly concerned that those of us in the audience who have spoken to you about this matter, for one reason or another, don't represent your constituents. Don't have the best interests of the city at heart. Let the voters decide. Please don't put this burden on your constituents to conduct a referendum, but do that yourself as leaders.

I can only speak for myself, but I would accept the result of a fair majority vote of my neighbors across the city. And then I could commit to you to work again for more green space at Willowick, planting trees in all of our city's parks. and finally completing a general plan that is up to date and meaningful for responsible development for all on the other hand if you really do not wish to delay this matter further I implore you that those of you who supported this

project at the last council meeting reconsider and vote to oppose the ordinance this evening rather than support them why would you do that well

mean wrap up the light is red to in the the proposed development agreement and

zoning amendment still adversely affect and conflict the general plan and according to this development agreement that's based on a flawed EIR if the EIR fails in court so does the development agreement everything fails please don't put your constituents in the position of having to take it that route let's work together let's put this behind us and let's get back to working in the best interests of our city thank you so much for your consideration thank you for your service

thank you Lisa good evening and thank you for allowing me to speak today for once I am at loss of words so I'm not going to speak as eloquently as the last two speakers but I'm here trying to demonstrate my frustration and my disappointment in the vote on last meeting that we had I feel like the the community demonstrated a passion for or against this project we have all spent numerous life units here in front of you as well as in the Planning

Commission that we will never get back again in order to explain to you our opposition to this project I'm just floored and disappointed in the decision that was made and I hope that you guys will reconsider I do want to I too reviewed the the meeting on video and you know really took some time to understand your guys comments Councilman Sarmiento I do agree with your comment specifically related to having a consensus on the moratorium on the building if I'm paraphrasing your your comments but you know basically saying

that you were disappointed that this project it was being pushed through because other projects in the neighborhood were were approved and that came up with other council members and so I'm really baffled a little bit that you guys voted for this project in what I felt was because we didn't come out and mass to oppose projects that were impacting your neighborhoods or your development you know I as well as other neighbors in the in the area here came out very strongly saying we need to you know put a limit to the number of high

density building and high density housing. That was very loud and very clear. So I'm kind of a little bit baffled that the decision to support this project was more or less that because we all didn't come out en masse to oppose other projects in other parts of the city. That just doesn't make sense. So I'm here once again, you know, spending another life unit trying to appeal to you to try to, you know, reconsider this. The community doesn't want this project. There has to be some other way in order to find the funding that 200 and something thousand dollars a year

it just it seems ridiculous and councilman Solario you're and I think glaciers your comments on item number I think it's 85 a to consider a dog park in the community perfect we've got a great piece of property to build a dog park in the area so that I will fully support you on that so thank Thank you for the dog park at 2525.

Thank you. Angel Barnes, followed by Lane Fradkin, followed by John Fradkin, followed by Dale Helwig.

Good evening. This huge apartment complex dramatically overdevelops a site that, since the 1920s, has been zoned for light commercial and office use. So for nearly 100 years, it has complemented the 11 or 1,200 adjacent single-family homes built between 1899 and 1970, many of which are on the historical registry. Today you're being asked to adopt spot zoning of 2525,

which is the creation of an island of a different use than the surrounding properties. As a retired judge, I can tell you that just five years ago, right here at this Court of Appeal for this county, it held that you must provide a compelling justification for spot zoning. And furthermore, prior to that, the California Environmental Quality Act, CEQA, required the City Council to consider a reasonable range of alternatives for that site.

while I was on the bench I couldn't participate in these proceedings but in the past year that I've been retired I haven't seen the range of alternatives nor heard what your compelling justification is in fact the City Planning Commission has repeatedly rejected this rezoning over 80% of Park Santiago neighborhood is strenuously opposed to it. The next nearest neighborhood, which is my

residence, Floral Park, is likewise strenuously opposed to it. It's inconceivable that 500 more cars will not adversely impact the traffic on Main. And three longtime Santa Ana realtors are prepared to testify and have testified before you that Park Santiago Homes will depreciate in value between 12 and 15 percent if this site is rezoned. This is based on the public sales data

from the Santa Ana neighborhoods where high-density rezoning has already happened, And it would equate to approximately $84,000 per house based on Park Santiago's 2019 median sales data. This is about a $100 million loss in property value in that neighborhood and a commensurate loss in property taxes.

Given the overwhelming opposition to this project, if the same four of you insist on ramming it down our collective throats, it looks terribly suspect. And I really urge you to please show these voters that what they want and the value of their homes matter to you. Thank you.

Thank you, Judge. Elaine followed by John followed by Dale followed by Justin Chapman good

evening mayor and council I'm Diane Fradkin Park Santiago and I'm here again to discuss this agenda item in my 25 years in the development business I've only been involved with one sequel lawsuit as a developer and we were able to defend that because we had a very, very strong EIR. Again, your EIR is grossly inadequate and very challengeable. And I hate to say this, but it's really terrible to see that you would waste hours and hours

of staff time and our time and thousands of dollars on a document that you supported that is very insufficient. That being said, you have an opportunity tonight to perhaps relook at the two ordinances before you, the rezoning and the development agreement.

It's not tidy. It needs to be cleaned up. And the I's need to be dotted and the T's need to be crossed. And you have an opportunity to do that. That being said, it's still not the best that we can do for our city. So there are a couple of options. You know, there's a CEQA lawsuit. There's a request for a referendum either by the city, which would help alleviate a lot of the issues and provide some cover for you. So I just want you to be aware of those items. We need to do what's right for the city, for the citizens.

and things need to be better performed, better scrutinized. You just can't jam things through because it's easy. We have to stand up for what's right, and that's what we're here doing tonight. So I appreciate your consideration. Thank you.

Thank you, Diane.

good evening John Fradkin Park San Diego resident I've got a quick handout for you it was also emailed to you guys earlier today and it is basically your own municipal code I'd like to speak to the ordinance NS dash 2980 which is the rezoning of the property from professional to special district number 93 a specific development excuse me I've followed this project since the beginning and this has always stuck in my craw that this is an

improper use of the language and I have no doubt that the City Council can change the zoning but it has to be done in a proper manner this is an improper use of the language. I would argue that the first four things are being violated, but to chime in with the judge, certainly number four, the language, the purpose and intent of the specific development language, one of the things is it recognizes the interdependence of land values and aesthetics, and provides a method to implement this interdependence in order to maintain the values

of surrounding properties well it does not maintain the values of the properties in Park Santiago I mean we're we've pretty you could argue that point however we've we the residents believe that our property values are going to be negative affected negatively affected the realtors believe that. The appraisers believe that. The Supreme Court believes that. And actually, I think even the applicant believes that by his actions. He'll tell you that our properties won't go down in

value, but his actions are that he is offering mitigation money to the people on Spurgeon that back up against his residents. So it's pretty easy for me to look at this and say that you can't use this language to change the zoning. Now if you want to change the zoning, figure out a way to do it properly. Thank you.

Thank You John Dale followed by Justin followed by Patricia Coleman.

evening mayor and council members and I'll say hello to Selena at home who's on maternity leave as well I'm sure she's following it you'll notice that we don't have the large crowd that we normally have here tonight and that's on purpose once again it's occurring over a holiday period of time as it did last year. We're gearing up, if need be, to continue the fight later on. So people are getting a little bit of a break tonight. This isn't a partisan issue. This is affecting homes

throughout Santa Ana, not just in Park Santiago, not in Floral Park, but across the city. We've seen developments come up all over the city that are just making Santa Ana an apartment city. businesses are going away to provide apartments the density of Santa Ana continues to rise twice as much as any other spot in San in Orange County we got to do something about that we know that we need more affordable housing affordable housing will not increase the density but it will decrease the overcrowding this does neither of or this doesn't fix the overcrowding issue

it's just going to add to the density and and it's wrong the letter that I gave you I sent out earlier today you may have already had a chance to read it I'm not going to go over those items but they reference the page in the staff report for your easy reference I do want to bring up though some of the glaring issues that I see in the development agreement one is you know they're providing $700,000 for park improvements but it's really up to $700,000 we ought to say they flat out provide $700,000 because if the design comes in at $200,000

$300,000 they're only on the hook for 150 50% of it hold them accountable for what they're doing there's a lot of other items on that list that were provided and also in mr. Rothenberg's letter that he provided that show that the development agreement is flawed it needs to be fixed and I don't think you can fix it tonight so you need to bring it back at another date and time to go ahead and work on that I support Santa Ana and I've been to many meetings besides 2525 I would like to be a part of the general plan update to ensure that we have something going forward. But like you guys know, you can't be every place at once.

My focus has been on 25-25, but I'm willing to work with you guys and the rest of the city in getting projects approved or issues addressed that will help out the city in a whole. So we're not just myphobic, or I don't even know if that's the right word. I get blamed for a lot of things. But we like to look at other issues. And I would like to look at other issues and help out Santa Ana. So I hope you take the time to look at the development agreement and realize that corrections need to be made on this. Thank you.

Thank you, Justin, followed by Patricia, followed by Stephen Swytek.

Council members and mayor, thank you for hearing me speak today. My name is Justin Chapman, and I live on Spurgeon Street up against 2525. I apologize for not being here the first time. I was working, so I wasn't able to share with you this. I'm here tonight to share with you why my wife and I oppose the development. Throughout this process, we made it clear to you, the developers, and our neighbors, that we were okay with redevelopment. For the last several months, we were on the fence with this project. It was not the most ideal option, but it was something that we were potentially willing to live with.

When we came to learn that this project could not pass CEQA and the potential traffic issues with the Main Street corridor that came with moving the Waukee intersection, we realized that we could not support or be indifferent of a project that is incapable of following a standard process as well as causing unnecessary negative traffic impacts. We understand that there are fewer daily trips with apartments. Our concern is with traffic flow on a major corridor next to the second busiest freeway in the country. If this design makes traffic flow less efficient on Main, why would we want to build it that way?

As for the homeless problem, luxury apartments are not a magic wand that make the homeless disappear. Building luxury apartments is not homeless repellent. Go to downtown San Diego, L.A., or San Francisco. They have luxury apartments charging two to three times the rent that the Addington will. Somehow homeless people are still able to do drugs. Defecate next to those buildings. If you don't believe me, download the app that tracks this activity and see for yourself. Yes, there is an app for that. If voting yes on the Edington means we get to amend state laws so that we can actually do something about the homeless crisis,

then I will gladly fall on the sword for the state of California and let's build this thing already. However, that is not the case. We're just trying to build apartments. This will not solve the homeless issue. When you make your final decision, I hope that you were able to remove all emotion from your decision. Also, I hope you realize that because we made bad decisions in the past, that is not justification for making bad decisions in the present or the future. If you vote yes, please address the objections given to you by NSAPA with supporting facts.

Show the opposition that traffic flow will be just as efficient or better with moving the Waukee intersection. If it will make traffic flow less efficient, please give supporting facts for why that is a good thing for the area. I hope that you have all the information to put these concerns to rest. Please know that my wife and I want the best option for this property. If it was a museum going up, we would want the best museum possible. If it's apartments to be built, we want the best option possible, and not just for the developers, but the entire community. Please prove that to us that this is the best possible option. Thank you.

Patricia, followed by Stephen, followed by Michael Ovalle.

you mayor and members of the council thank you very much for listening to us once again on this project I really appreciate it and I just wanted to let you know where I'm coming from with this because I I appreciate I appreciate the rules that levels the playing field between people who have a lot of money and people who don't and we have a developer with a lot of money and we have a neighborhood with some people with money and some not and I think the rules are one of the things that helps to label level the play field I also

appreciate logic and and with this development we have an argument that this development is going to protect us from high-intensity development that's the reason for the rezoning and it's also going to be an example of high intensity development and that's the reason for being in a district center you can't be both so I just want you to consider that and just as far as things that I sent you this afternoon I don't know if it went through because it was a big file and I'm not used to doing that and I'm glad to hear that the park boundary is not being moved as it says here but that's a good example of

problems that you have with what you're being sent it's not accurate I had somebody do a GIS study of it and the footprint doesn't match so there was a reason to be concerned especially because it says relocated to new park limits I appreciate madam yes thank you I appreciate you giving me the update on that I also wanted to point out that you have no study on safety for that intersection with regard to pedestrians other than a single one sample size of

one for a study no study has a sample size of one so um maybe you could give it the same consideration as tiny Tim Plaza and have a a line of sight study done for that because you clearly cannot be in that intersection and see the beginning of the crosswalk try it I tried to show you last time you can't that's a that's a clear problem substantially increases the hazards due to a foreign due to a design feature and that is a hazard you can't see the crosswalk and then lastly you know what it doesn't fit that doubled side-by-side turn lane

doesn't fit it makes you widen Main Street 12 feet where does that come from you're going to take a lane out of each a foot out of each lane and then you're going to have a road diet at that pinch point or you're going to have to take some science center land you need 12 feet for the extra lane where is that coming from that's not well thought out if you look at the developers drawing for that there's no room for a sidewalk you know there's drawings that are missing parts so thank you very much for your attention I hope you reconsider and get this cleaned up before you vote on it thank you

good evening mayor council council people thank you for allowing us another opportunity to discuss the development I'm concerned that the development agreement as has been pointed out before by others is not sufficiently detailed and specific in terms of requirements of the of the developer both financial and otherwise I'm concerned about the reasons posed by some of the council

people to vote in favor, that being by at least two, that there wasn't adequate support or opposition for developments that were near to their residences or in their vicinity. And consequently, it seemed to me that a reason posed was, well, you didn't help me out, so we're not going to help you out. I don't think that puts the interests of the city first. I'm further worried that the developer chose to make his site an attractive nuisance, as it were,

in order to make a false justification for at least Councilman Solario to seek fencing as a cure for the homeless problem, which has been brought about in effect by the developer. So he created a problem that had to be addressed, and that problem was raised as a reason to allow the development to take place.

So I don't know if Councilman Solario is listening because, as I see all day, both here and the previous meeting, he's just playing with his electronic device. It seems like...

I haven't seen you look at a speaker yet, so I don't know. So both here and other places, maybe they should be checked as devices are checked at classrooms. So I urge that this council permit the development to go to citywide decision. Certainly 80% of the residents are opposed. If indeed we're talking about having the Council act for the benefit of the residents,

then perhaps a citywide referendum would be the best way to decide this issue. And I would encourage you to permit that to happen. Thank you. Thank you.

After Michael, we have Tim Rush.

Thank you, Mayor, Councilmembers. Michael Valle from Park Santiago. I'd just like to say thank you for everybody who supported us this whole time. And Councilmember Inglacia, thank you. You do get a bad rap. You were shooting for a win-win for everybody. Unfortunately, not everybody can win. We don't all get trophies. And we can just look now to tidy up things and maybe defer things, possibly deny things.

And going forward, you know, with my layman's eyes, I read the development agreement. It's very boilerplate. It looks like it was copied off of in the last development agreement. There's so many different things. They talk about storage. The plans don't show 250 square feet of storage per unit. Where does this all come in? We talk about the development fees, $50,000 per year for continuances, if that's the correct terminology. But, you know, you can get $450,000, not $50,000. so there's that and just again thank you for everything you've done and I appreciate you taking the time and possibly doing the right thing

and I wasn't going to speak tonight because if hundreds of people couldn't convince you guys to do the right thing then what was I going to say tonight but I appreciate everything you do and once again your consideration thank you applause

Good evening, Mr. Mayor, members of the council. So here we are again, two years into this project, umpteen dozen hearings, hundreds of neighborhood leaders coming out, and residents speaking against this project for a variety of reasons. this reminds me of the talk that Winston Churchill gave before Congress when he came to the US and was asked about prosecuting the war and they said when do you think this will end and he said well this is not the end and it's not the beginning he said and it's not the beginning of the end but it might be the end of the beginning

I don't even know if we've met to the end of the beginning at this point but my goodness I would say to you four who voted for this that you are on the precipice of cutting the head off of the neighborhood movement which was started some 35 years ago in Santa Ana led and championed primarily by Dan Grisette I mean Dan Young and Dan Grisette who was on the council at that time and other council members but they foresaw what the neighborhood movement could be for Santa Ana. I don't know how you will ever stand in front of a neighborhood group

and say, please get involved because we're going to listen to you. Many people are saying, we're not being governed, we're being ruled because that's what rulers do. They do what the hell they want to do. They don't do what their constituents plead and beg and ask them to do. So I'm going to ask you again tonight, please withhold your approval on this project. Thank you.

Thank you. That was the last speaker, so now let me bring it to Council for comment or consideration.

Move data.

We have a motion by Councillor Solario to move the item.

Phil BacerraItem —

Mr. Mayor, I'd like to go ahead and put forth the substitute motion.

Well, right now there is no motion because there was no second, but go ahead with your substitute.

Phil BacerraItem —

I'd like to go ahead and ask that we move the item to be denied, as I stated at the previous meeting. The environmental, the zoning amendment, and the general plan amendment. Second. Mr. Mayor, I have comments.

All right, let's go ahead and comment on the motion. Go ahead.

Phil BacerraItem —

Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I mean, I can address the audience, but I think it's important for my colleagues. Right now, I mean, you guys have this experience over I do. State law requires two readings of ordinances. We have a chance to really consider what the community has said to us. And what the community has said is there's a bunch of holes in this thing. I mean, we want to make sure that we're protecting the public purse because we know there's going to be litigation. And who wouldn't? There's gigantic holes in the way this was processed, the way it worked, as it was brought to us. And I know we have great staff.

Phil BacerraItem —

We have some really wonderful, competent staff. But there was just some big drops here, huge drops. And I think for us to just ignore that and push it forward would be reckless and irresponsible. And I think that we really need to consider this. Now, if my colleagues are not comfortable with denying it outright, I think as some of the members of the public had mentioned about considering a referendum, letting the voters decide, that's one option.

Phil BacerraItem —

But from my background in planning and the technical background that I have, it's like scratching a chalkboard, knowing that we're going to ignore some of the biggest flaws in this, whether it's just the whole concept of this general plan designation. The D.C. is not the right designation for this. And for us to continue down the path like everything's okay, I would really implore my colleagues just to take a second and consider what we're about to approve. Again, thankfully, state law does give us a second bite at the apple. And again, I would ask you to just consider what you're about to do. Thank you.

Mayor Provene. I'm just going to thank you, Council Member Becerra, for those words. I also again like to remind the council that at what point are we going to listen to the constituents? They're the ones that put us here. They're the ones that we answer to. We don't answer to anyone else. We answer to the public.

All right, if there's additional comment, we'll take it. Councilor Solario? Yeah, just a couple of brief comments right now. first on the sequence stuff if there are issues they're really the the best environment for that is through the legal process not not here because I think our staff and our EIR team and our city attorney stand by it I think there are other suggestions like the pedestrian bridge that are important and I think I mentioned actually to Dale and Rob Richardson that you know on South Main Street there's their signage they're kind of welcoming folks into the city and

And I always felt that it was awkward that we don't have a bookend to that. So I do see that there's some merit to that idea, and that could be done separately. It doesn't have to be done here. So I'm prepared to support the item as is. Thank you.

Any other comments?

Phil BacerraItem —

Mr. Mayor, I'd just like to put one more thing out there. Going back to what I said about state law and this whole idea that we do get two bites at the apple, I don't think the ball's in our court for us to turn around and just say, we'll let the courts figure it out. We're basically ceding away our responsibility.

Phil BacerraItem —

As the pro tem mentioned, we were put here by the residents. And so for us to ignore the residents and somehow say, well, no, we'll just let the courts figure it out. Again, it just shows that we're not willing to take the responsibility of our action. We have two bites of the apple here. We have a chance to take into account what the residents have said. And there's a famous statement by Aristotle that says, law is reason without passion. And if you take all the passion out of what the folks said tonight, there's a lot of reason not to approve this thing. And then when you take into account the passion of these folks

Phil BacerraItem —

that have no reason to have to defend the fact that they're defending their neighborhood, you don't have to. Ladies and gentlemen, do not come up and apologize because you're standing up for your neighborhood and you didn't go to every other meeting that was ever done about any other land use item that came before this council. Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for standing up for your neighborhood. I live on the south side of town, completely opposite from you guys, and I would do the same darn thing. So thank you for what you do. And to my colleagues again, second bite at the apple, folks.

David PenalozaItem —

Yes, Councillor Peña-Losa, please. I'd like to make a substitute motion, But just with some comments first, thank you to the residents also that came out to speak.

David PenalozaItem —

I am supportive of this project, but I do see what you guys clearly stated today, and I do see it through this developmental agreement. So my substitute motion would be to continue the item for 30 days, possibly even 60. I'm not sure what's allowed to really get down into the knit of this and just look at it very carefully and take a closer look and make sure if it needs work, then we work on it.

David PenalozaItem —

I do like the project. I've said that before. But if there are issues, and I've seen them just from going over the development agreement myself and going over the various notes and listening to the speakers, I'd like to make that substitute motion. Thank you for that. Is there a second? I'm not sure if there's a, Madam City Attorney, if there's a limit. Can it be 60 days if you want 60 days?

David PenalozaItem —

We could do 30.

It's whatever days you state, Council Member, for their consideration.

David PenalozaItem —

I make the SOTUS motion to continue that in for 30 days. But with also not just continue it and nothing get done. I really want to, I don't know if we should have, you know, have meetings with the City Attorney to the Parks and Targo residents, to the applicant. you know make sure that we're actually having these conversations about this developmental agreement not just continue it and be back in 30 days with absolutely no adjustments progress um and that's that's my my my um all right is there a second uh mr mayor i'll

Phil BacerraItem —

second it for discussion um i want to thank my colleague for making the substitute motion um but what i do want to ask my colleague is what what do you hope to accomplish in that time and i'm not saying that there's nothing to be accomplished i just want to understand where you're going with this because I think there are some things that could be accomplished, but I want to understand where you're going.

David PenalozaItem —

My goal is to accomplish these goals that have clearly been stated out. Not only did I notice them while going through the developmental agreement, but also in Mr. Helvick's letter and email, there are things that are, to me, a little goofy that should be looked into and strengthen or look closer and have more substance to it.

Phil BacerraItem —

So more of just kind of, say, revising the development agreement, kind of correcting some of the punctuation and other items that are in here.

David PenalozaItem —

Not just the punctuation, but I'm saying the actual substance and the body and the information that's in it.

Phil BacerraItem —

Well, commas matter, so I think that's important. But I know there are some issues that were pointed out in here that are a little more meatier than others, and that's why 30 days, I think, any time to really reconsider and think about this is important, But I think we all have to understand that there's a lot of things that have been pointed out by our residents here that may take a little longer than 30 days.

Let me see if you'd consider a friendly amendment that would be to go to 45 days because it's the holidays coming up right now. It's going to be Christmas. It's going to be New Year's. It's not a regular 30 days right now.

David PenalozaItem —

I think that if we really just if there's a will there's a way and if we really put you know get together to work well and maybe in 30 days I don't I'm I have a I don't know about everybody but everybody else but my work ethic I mean I work through the holiday through the holidays but I mean if that's the the I don't know if my colleagues want to chime in Mr. May well so

Phil BacerraItem —

So maybe perhaps the motion, I mean, going for the 30-day mark, maybe we just make a date certain that we bring it back in our first council meeting. Are we meeting in our first council meeting in January?

No, we're not.

Phil BacerraItem —

So maybe our second meeting in January.

David PenalozaItem —

That's fine.

David PenalozaItem —

Which is 45 days. Right.

But we could call a special meeting if we wanted to.

If I may clarify, Mayor. So if the purpose of the continuation is to get clarifications to discrepancies, whether they're accurate or not, and have staff provide you that information, we can continue the second reading. If the purpose for the continuation is to make substantive changes to the agreement, it would require us to do a new public hearing and introduce it again.

I don't think. I think it's the former, not the latter.

Councilman Sarmiento. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. And that's, I think, where I was going to try to get some clarification from the city attorney, because my understanding is this is not two bites at the apple. This is a second reading from a first reading. You can't make any material changes from the first adoption of what action we took. So you can't rewrite things or make substantive changes. So we really are looking at the four corners of the document. We can make some adjustments. We can make some minor changes, but we can't redraft a document. That's my understanding on the second reading.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

And if I may comment on that, I think the comments that you received this evening appear in both places. So you've heard some comments today that are about the procedure, that are about crossing the T's, dotting the I's, correcting some things. But I think I also heard comments that were substantive. Why did the city agree to only accept X dollars versus more? Why wouldn't the city do X or Y? So we can evaluate all the comments that were made. We can get you some information back. And then perhaps then you could make the ultimate decision on whether you truly want to go back and renegotiate it

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

or if you want to just address some of those alleged discrepancies that have been mentioned this evening.

Right. So it's a scope that we're talking about that we can reconsider. So let me just take you back to some of the comments because I think some of those comments were important that were made. on other proposals or other issues that have been brought before us, where have we put the second reading on our practice? Have they been on consent, or have they been segregated into some of our business matters, or have they, by our practice, been placed on consent?

Typically, the second reading is placed on the consent.

Okay. On spot zoning, can you address that, Madam City Attorney? And when it comes to spot zoning, are we talking about zoning that's incompatible? Are we talking about zoning that, let's say, these are both considered residential areas, right? Like the proposed project corner is being considered to be rezoned residential, and it's abutting an adjacent residential area. Wouldn't a spot zone, in your analysis, be if you were going to introduce something that is a light industrial use right up against a residential? Isn't that more of the example of what a spot zone would be?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

Yeah, the spot zoning is when you have an island surrounded by other land uses which are not compatible or consistent with the land use that you're designating to that island. I think we have had this issue raised before. We discussed it with staff, and I think the issue here is that because it's a residential use adjacent to a residential use that we see throughout our community, multifamily residential up against single-family residential, and I think the determination was made that it was not a spot zoning situation.

Okay. Now, the path here hasn't been linear, and I think as somebody mentioned, I think Tim may have mentioned, it's been a couple of years, so it has been before us for quite a long time, and it hasn't been linear. I think it came before us earlier this year, I think sometime in the spring of this year, and it was remanded back to the Planning Commission, from what I recall, And it was remanded to address those very concerns that many of the folks that came and spoke to us wanted addressed. The volume of units, issues having to do with parking, traffic, the park, everything else.

And so I don't think that there was an effort, because I think if there was an effort to just jam this through and not consider the comments and the really relevant comments that were made by the residents, it could have been adopted earlier in the spring. But the idea was to have that discussed further. The proposal came back to us modified with a reduced unit count, but also was something that I think none of us saw, which was a proposal to allow for parking for the cube. And so that's something I think that really hadn't been considered at all during the first discussion.

So I don't know if that was something that could have been somehow kept from the council's consideration, but I do think that that was something more that Senator Umberg had advocated for, received some money, and it looked like they were able to go ahead and bundle this. So finally, on the issue of a referendum question, the way I understand it, Madam City Attorney, the referendum could be achieved two ways. It could be achieved through the city council direction, and it could be done by initiative by the residents or any other group, right?

Or are those the two only limited ways or paths to get this considered on a referendum?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

A referendum, by its definition, is an effort by the community, the voters, to have a look at what you've approved. So it's only when you have an approval that you have the referendum. The city council would approve ordinances, then the community has 30 days to file the referendum. The initiative can be placed on the ballot by the city council. An initiative can also be placed on the ballot by the residents. But in this scenario, if the city council approves these ordinances, then the citizens have a 30-day referendum period. If the city council on its own, if it desired to propose that the voters approve it,

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

as I heard some commenters say tonight, then you would be doing what is called a City Council-sponsored initiative.

Right, at a cost, right?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

Yes.

Okay. Now, finally, my question to you is because your office has been overseeing the analysis, the CEQA analysis and all the legal documents that surround this in addition to the planning department and our planning staff, what's your assessment of the integrity of the document?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

We have reviewed the document very carefully. There's always going to be differences of opinion, but the environmental impact report, in our opinion, is not only adequate but solid. And we understand that there have been comments and people take issue with it, but a significant amount of time was put in reviewing that document. It has been reviewed not only by the city's legal representatives, but by the developers' legal representatives as well.

Great. Thank you. Those are the questions I have for you.

Phil BacerraItem —

Mr. Mayor.

All right. Yeah, you made the second on the motion. Go ahead.

Phil BacerraItem —

I'd just like to ask the city attorney, when I initially talked about state law giving us two bites of the apple, if this council were to decide tonight to change course and vote to deny the environmental, the zone change, and the general plan amendment, what would happen then?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

So at this point, as you may recall, you adopted resolutions at your former meeting, and that certified the EIR. So in order to undo that action, you would have to have a motion for reconsideration, and you'd have to take that action. But with respect to the two ordinances, the one for the development agreement and the one for the zone change, if you decline to take action on that, your earlier action, the resolution approving the general plan, would not go into effect because there was a condition. And the reason we condition is because we don't want the city council by resolution to do a general plan amendment,

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

and then if the other documents fail, so we condition and we say that the earlier resolution on the general plan will not go into effect unless the ordinances are adopted.

Phil BacerraItem —

But just to clarify, so if this council were to vote to rescind its action from the previous meeting, then the project approval would be...

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

If the city council tonight did not affirmatively pass the second reading, then the earlier resolution would not take effect. If you continued those items and passed them at a later date, then it would take effect.

Phil BacerraItem —

But with the previous part, though, if we were to vote to rescind it, then that's it.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

Correct. If you were to vote to rescind it, then of course you would have to start all over again and go back to the Planning Commission. And I think that's the issue that the city manager addressed with respect to your development agreement. Development agreements by law have to go first to your Planning Commission, and they have to get a recommendation. So to the extent that you were to make any significant changes, we not only go back, but we go way back if you were going to make significant changes to the development agreement.

Thank you.

And I believe that the maker of the motion acknowledges that, and so does the second. Do you have additional comment? Jose wants to speak. Council Member Solario and then Pinal. Yes.

I'm generally open to a continuance. I'm not sure really, honestly, that it's going to accomplish much. I mean, I've read some of the concerns, and I think there are difference of opinion, or we're referring to different things. but if it's to clarify things I guess we could but maybe our city attorney can just be generally again to the the letter from mr. Helbig in terms of your you yourself and the the EIR attorney have have looked at that letter and and

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

what were your conclusions yeah we just received that letter today you know we I'm not prepared at the moment to address each and every one of those issues. If we were given some more time, we would do that with staff, and then we could come back to you and describe what our response may be. And if there was something needed to be addressed, we would make the recommendation that you make the changes and address it.

Okay, thank you.

David PenalozaItem —

Okay, yes, Councillor Peña-Losa, please. My comments, just in reference to the – I basically just want staff to look and with the residents, everybody look at this carefully, investigate these claims. I've read it over myself. Some I agree with, some I don't. Like Councilmember Salero said, there are differences of opinion. But I just want staff jointly with some of the community leaders to look at this, investigate these claims. Are they true? Are they factual? Can we address making those edits that are not so major where it would require sustaining it back?

David PenalozaItem —

and in regards to the 30 or 45 days we we're supposed to adopt the schedule for 2020 tonight I have no problem not canceling that first meeting in January it's a seventh that's six days after the holiday the New Year's Day staffs back on the second that leaves staff three days to look at any staff reports or final I mean I see no problem having that council meeting on the 7th of course that's up for discussion when that item comes up tonight but that would be my motion

all right so right now the motion is to continue it we don't know if it's the seventh or two weeks after that to paint well i would i would suggest i would suggest the the i think i'm going to be out of town on the seventh i don't know but i'm pretty sure we've had this contemplated date for a long time I don't think the clerk how long would be contemplating madam clerk

sorry quite a long time and primarily because the agenda would not be generated on time so when we come back on January 2nd then we have literally

one or two days to publish that agenda so I suggest we leave it as was I I appreciate the intent.

David PenalozaItem —

Oh, okay. I was going to say, I mean, staff is highly compensated to really put this together in two days, but I forget it's just you. So I wouldn't... All right, look, we're going around in circles.

Final comment, but who hasn't spoken? Go ahead. Go ahead.

Okay. This is just getting too complicated for me.

And I'm going to say this truthfully and honestly. This is just the residents getting caught in the middle of all this mess. And I apologize for what's going on here. Just think it's a little bit of games of charades and games here between some of my colleagues up here on the dais who have personal vendettas against the developer. And I think it's a shame that that's happening. and the reason I can say that is because at the last meeting in January, I'm sorry, in January or February when we talked about it, I believe it was Mayor Pro Tem and the mayor said, he's like, you know, they didn't want to move with it

unless they found out what the dark money was. I have no idea what the dark money is. And I just feel it's unfortunate because we're wasting a lot of staff's time, we're wasting a lot of the developers' time, and we're wasting a lot of time from the residents. and I just I don't like playing games I don't and I feel it's very unfortunate I think you know right now it's kind of like you know the mayor saying I won't be here that's his way of saying okay let's do for 45 days without you even noting noting that it's 45 days that that's what he's

calling for and I say do it if we're going to do something you know like you're saying I think we have very competent staff let's do it by the next meeting I think if we have issues I think our staff can do this. I am in support if you want to do this by the next meeting on the 18th. And I think that, or whenever it is that we have our next meeting, I think we have to do it before we go on that break because it's just, and it'll give us enough time to do this. Two weeks is two weeks and I think it's enough time for us to get all these things taken care of. And you know,

Today, I walked the development on 2525, the property, and it's very scary out there. We, with Commissioner Chris Smith and also with Lisa Mills, one of the residents, we walked it. And we were told to leave by a transient who was coming out of the building. And there's a lot of transients there. It's not safe. It's not safe for anyone. I do like it like I've shared with you I just don't see the negatives for this development and I feel that we you know with this we can you know we can um

iron out iron out some things but I think we can we could tighten it up a little bit but I don't think 30 days is is the way to go I think by the next meeting let's just do it if we're gonna do this either yes or no both the residents are waiting both the developers are waiting we need to stop

David PenalozaItem —

wasting everybody's time. I'll make an amendment to my motion to do it to December 21st then that which would be the next scheduled.

David PenalozaItem —

It's even less. Oh yeah December 17th. It's two weeks. Well Mr. Mayor I'll go ahead and

Phil BacerraItem —

rescind my second of his previous motion and I'm not gonna be seconding that motion and I think we're all ignoring something very fundamental here. You can tweak the development agreement all day. The fact of the matter is what's being requested can't be approved and it is completely susceptible to a legal challenge period. So we can sit here and change some dollar amounts and some mitigation factors and that's all fine and dandy but at the end of the day there are some fundamental flaws. That's why we should just let the legal

challenge take place. Why should we wait for the legal challenge when we

Phil BacerraItem —

have it on our plate? That just does not make sense. I'm ready to vote today but

No, no, and I... But I'll second the motion. And Councilman Solario, I agree with what you said.

Phil BacerraItem —

I think a slight continuance, given the magnitude of flaws with what's before us, I actually agree with you on that. I don't think 7 days, 14 days, 30 days is going to do anything. So with that, I defer back to my original motion, which was to deny the three items.

Well, right now we have this motion. It was just seconded by Solario. So any additional... Mayor Pro Temp.

My position was mentioned a minute ago by one of the Councilmembers, so I'd like to address it. You know, ladies and gentlemen, this stuff is really, really tough up here. If you only knew what's going on in the background, I've been very quiet for a very long time, and I'm not going to point any fingers, but the people behind this development or sitting in this room, I'm not going to point fingers, okay, or say who it was, admitted to me that they were part of that dark money, okay? We don't need that kind of business here.

When this dark money was getting behind this development and started going after this gentleman right over here, and the people that were coming out and tarnishing this man's reputation, you know, you only have one reputation. Every individual here has one reputation. You have to take care of it. When you go out there and you come after someone just because, you know, you're coming after, you know, something that you want, monetary value, or you're trying to make some cash out of that, give me a break. That's where I'm going to draw the line. Now, if the FPPC wants to come and talk to me, I'm right here. I'm always truthful.

FBI wants to come and talk to me, come and speak to me. I'm right here. I'll be happy to talk to you. The thing is that I'm getting sick and tired of these kind of things running around. And you know what? This stuff is terrible. It's terrible. Like I said, people here only knew what was going on. How many special interests are working together to get this stuff done?

And that's why I'm a no. I'm a no when people are doing these kind of things. Now look, there's a recall after me. There's a recall after another council member here. You know what? If you want this job, you can have it. But I don't break. I'm not going to mess around. And I'm sick of it. Now, those are my comments. And you know what? Better be careful what you're doing up here.

All right. With that, I'm going to just go ahead and call for the vote. We have a motion with a second. Mr. Mayor, what are we voting on? The motion is to continue it for two weeks to the 21st.

The 17th.

17th.

May I say something?

Briefly. Briefly.

The dark money is from the POA, from the Police Officers Association. That's where the dark money came from. And so, you know, I guess we have differences in opinion where the dark money is coming from. So that's who's recalling us.

The dark money's working together, and I told you many times.

Yeah, I know. I know.

All right. With that, we have a motion and a second. Those in favor?

David PenalozaItem —

Madam City Attorney. Go ahead.

Clarify that.

David PenalozaItem —

Like I said, I just don't want to continue it just to continue. I need everybody to know that I want these conversations and staff to look into these claims and to check them for accuracy. Are they true? because if they are true this could could lead to another continuance until address and that's where I wanted to see is to make sure that these claims are looked into I saw them some I agree with some I don't but and I don't want this to you know be the day the morning of the council meeting like usually happens

David PenalozaItem —

and get an email from staff saying oh here the the no no no I need an answer by it shouldn't take long to go over this have legal and look at them i understand council

member your request and staff certainly can do the clarifications for you in advance of the 17th in fact we've already started on that process okay thank you all right can we clarify the uh the vote

or the motion i believe the motion is to continue the matter for two weeks until the 17th and um A second with Solario, right? Correct. Yeah, a second with Solario. So those in favor of the two-week continuance press.

Just for clarification, but taking into consideration that things are going to get done, not just for the second week.

To the best of their effort, and then we'll take it up in two weeks.

What's to the best of their effort? I would say it's addressing all of the concerns that have been. All of them? Yeah.

Because I just don't want to come back and say, oh, we're only able to get one.

David PenalozaItem —

All the comments are submitted today, not just Mr. Helvig's.

Phil BacerraItem —

Hold on. We've received... Go ahead, Council Member. I'm sorry, Mr. McStatter. I apologize. We've received a ton of communications. If we're only going to say Mr. Helvig's letter, that's fine. But we've also, over the last two meetings, we've had a ton of communications. So if you're going to ask our staff, who I believe wholeheartedly are able-bodied, to have them go through all of that and come back in less than two weeks and say, okay, here's everything fixed, I don't think that's reasonable for them.

Well, they can try. They've looked at it already. So you're just trying to address the issues that supposedly we haven't.

Phil BacerraItem —

So just for clarification, are we only saying that we are expecting staff to address Mr. Helvig's letter or all the communication? Because there's a lot of flaws pointed out from various members of the residents here, from the folks tonight to the 100-plus that came out two weeks ago. So what exactly are we asking staff to do? Because we don't want them to come back and go, oh, we didn't know that's what you wanted. So let's help them by clarifying what we're asking them to look at.

Phil BacerraItem —

Maker of the motion, please.

David PenalozaItem —

And most of it was echoing Mr. Helvig's letter anyways, but it's about 95% the same. The same claims are the interest.

Phil BacerraItem —

So Mr. Helvig's letter then.

David PenalozaItem —

Sure.

All right. We have a motion and a second, and it's up to staff to understand it.

So with that, those in favor, please. It's not up to staff. It's not up to staff.

Correct.

David PenalozaItem —

Go over these claims. Okay.

Correct.

No, no. Let's just vote. Those in favor.

I don't know. If you could chime in. Yeah. I just. The city manager wants to speak.

Go ahead, city manager.

then we're going to vote. Mayor, my understanding is it's primarily Dale Helvig's letter to go through and provide the clarifications for the items that he is pointing out. To the extent that we've heard any legal challenges, that's not something we would have a discussion in public, but certainly our city attorney could provide you under attorney-client privileges are rebuttal to those types of items. So staff will be focusing on the Dale Helvig letter, is my understanding.

Additional comment? Otherwise, I'm ready to make comments.

I know we're ready to call for the question, but again, I think a lot of what was said in the different documents that we've received, a lot of them are duplicative. We see that those same issues appear both in the letter as in the challenges or the concerns with the CEQA documents. So, look, Madam City Attorney, you have very competent staff, both inside counsel and outside counsel, that can review this. And again, I just want to remind all of us about the scope that we're limited by on this. So to the extent that you look at the documents that you see, these are the same concerns that we've been dealing with,

both at the commission level and at the council, that are similar.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

Yeah, and I just want to remind the council that through the formation of this public record, we have addressed those things in previous hearings. I completely agree with the city manager's comments. Let staff review these issues. she will report to you on staff issues. I will look and analyze at the legal concerns that were raised. If I feel I need to communicate with you, I'll communicate with you as I usually do on legal matters. And if I determine that we need to put something on the record to address any of these concerns, we'll make that recommendation when we come back to you. Because we want to have a solid

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

record to support the council's decisions as you know how CEQA works. If I determine that we need to do something like that, then I'll come back and I'll give you the information and the

recommendations at that time. You'll advise us accordingly. Absolutely. All right. I'm going to make a comment. I haven't had an opportunity yet, so I'll make a brief comment. We're going to vote. I'm going to support the continuance. I hope that it's able to, you know, resolve something substantive. If it's not, then at the next council meeting, I'll probably go back to my original position, which is that it's a good project in the wrong location. And that I just believe it is not an appropriate project to approve.

And for me, it's not a personal vendetta. I did approve 1,224 units over at the Heritage, which is over by Red Hill and Dyer, and it was the same developer. And that was on a 4-3 vote. and I voted for that project. So I just want to put that in context for the record.

Phil BacerraItem —

Mr. Mayor, may I just ask one question? Final comment. No, just a question. Just from a calendaring perspective, if we were to go ahead and vote for the continuance to the next meeting, when would the staff report be available for us? Or when is it required to be available?

My hope, sir, would be to get it to you prior to the council meeting, so allow me to have at least seven days.

ASAP. They're going to make their best effort, which is why I wanted more time, but let's see what happens. They're going to make their best efforts. So with that, those in favor, please press green. Those opposed, go red. So motion carries. Can we get a different color for Council Member Becerra?

I know he's new, and he's already gotten a birthday cake, and he's gotten a reception coming up. When's your reception, Council Member?

Phil BacerraItem —

Tomorrow afternoon.

Tell people where?

Phil BacerraItem —

It'll be here at City Hall.

What time?

Phil BacerraItem —

5 o'clock.

There you go. If anybody wants gum, there's a free reception tomorrow at 5. And with that, let's continue with our meeting. Now I think we're beyond the first item. Hopefully that was the longest item.

Councilmember Sarmiento, if you have to leave, I would like to excuse you. Go ahead.

I'm just going to stick around for one of the consent calendar items. Is that where we're going or are we going someplace else? Consent right now. 20B. All right.

20A, 20B.

Councilor Iglesias has 28, 20C, and 22D. And, Councilor Sarmiento, which item did you have? 20B as in boy. 20B as in boy. Why don't we take those first because then I know you have to leave and then I'll entertain the balance. So let's go to 20B. Unfortunately, or fortunately, I don't know, but I do have speakers on that item. Let's go ahead. Phil Berry, or Paul Berry, followed by Bia Tretuli, followed by Gerald Tretuli, and then Patricia Coleman. If you can all please come and speak. Go ahead. Please, Paul.

Yes, I'm Paul Berry. I've been here before on climate issues and I just briefly I want to thank my ward councilmember David Penelosa for hosting a meeting with the people interested in the CCA movement and coming to the meeting was mr. min and miss McCann and I think it's important that publicly we say that Santa Ana is studying the CCA movement so I think that's important with regard to this

item this is a this is very interesting if you've got a your your last item was

a one about infill and this is this is somewhat of an infill issue as well I came here because I will use this section of pedestrian infrastructure that's being proposed here in 20b this is we're talking about a pedestrian connection to San Diego Santiago Park I'm a ride bicycle all over the place and I will use this looking at the cost it's like a million two hundred thousand dollars I have no background in with the Aramex construction or the price so I have no idea it's been brought to you by I would

imagine you're planning people and it's probably very easily approvable I don't know but it is it's good I would just want to point out it's a rather small section and quite a block of change there and this is this is the kind of fundamental issues that you're dealing with is very complicated later tonight you've got 75a or which is about the fire codes this has to do with the distributed energy this is a change infill and distributed energy are the two biggest things you're going to handle over the next five to ten years and you have the most one of the most important pieces of real estate one of

the most important locations in all of Southern California is coming up on your 60A here later tonight at 4th and Main. So I'm hoping that this will meet your approval. If not, certainly it will be used. It will be used if you build this thing, okay? Thank you.

Thank you. B, followed by Gerald, followed by Patricia.

Okay, I'm Bea Dere Tilly. My husband and family and I live directly behind the dirt portion of the nature trail in Santiago Park. So we're in Santiago Park. We're about a block away from where this is going. We wholeheartedly support this. And we're really happy to see that we have this once-in-a-generation, if not once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to expand a park in Santa Ana and to create more open space, create more recreational opportunities. When city staff first came to us with it, there were some neighborhood concerns about safety and so on.

Those concerns, in my opinion, were addressed and then some, and money was found to build gates that can close at night along the trail and keep it safe from perhaps what could be prowlers. We really, really enjoy having the parks used by people. As the previous speaker said, you want to see people out there. You want to see your constituents out there bicycling, walking their dogs, using our trails, using our parks. And this is one way to encourage that, to take a dead space in the city and turn it into a living space.

Our only concern is that this trail connects to the nature center and the trails in the nature center. And we would like to see native plants and native trees instead of what's been proposed there now. So let's go ahead and applaud this effort. Let's make it better. And let's make it a place not just for the residents of Santa Ana, but for all the raccoons, the possums, and the hawks, and all the other critters that share our community so that they have a spot to call home. And native plants and native trees will allow that to happen. Thank you very much for supporting this project.

Thank you. And just for the record, this is along the Lincoln Avenue pedestrian pathway. at Santiago Park. Gerald, come on up, followed by Patricia Coleman.

I'll make this quick. So I just want to voice my support for reestablishing access to the park along that Lincoln corridor because years ago when they double-tracked, they did take away access from a lot of people easy access to the park. So this will restore that and I'm in favor of that and I think this will be a good thing for the neighbors in the area.

Thank you.

Patricia?

Hi, I'm Patricia Coleman again, and thank you. I've been looking forward to this for the park for many, many years, and I didn't think it was going to happen. So I really want to thank staff for putting together a very creative and I'm sure laborious project, and I'm in favor of it. And like Bea, though, I would like to see natives because that is the plant palette that we have been working with for the park. And some of the non-natives tend to be invasive, and so I would like that to be addressed. But I am in favor of the project, and I really appreciate the work. Thank you.

Thank you.

Councilor Sarmiento, I will defer to you. Yeah, thank you, Mr. Mayor. I just had a question for staff. I think it's a good project, and obviously it's going to serve a good public purpose and a community benefit. The question I had is I know that some funds are being reallocated to go ahead and realize this project, and I know some of the money is coming from M2, money I think to the tune of about $82,000, $83,000. That's coming from the Cabrillo Park sidewalk improvement project. So I know that there's been incredible improvement on Cabrillo from 17th to 4th, and it was much needed because a lot of the sidewalks were buckling,

and it was just lawsuits and liability waiting to happen. So to the extent that that's all been addressed, I know a majority of it's been addressed. I don't know if all of it's been addressed. Is there some residual work that needs to be done? And if there is, where are we going to backfill or find this money for any remaining work?

I'll ask our Acting Public Works Director to address that particular funding stream as to why it's available.

So this is Maiden Voyage's Acting Public Works Director?

Good evening, Mayor, Council members. Yes, there is some residual work need to be done at the Caprio Park. There is some stump grinding and more trees to be planted. That will come from our street maintenance funds, and we're getting bids on the replanting and doing that work. And it will happen sometime in early January.

Okay, so the timeline on the project as it was originally drafted is not going to be disrupted too much as a result of the reallocation of these funds?

No, we will start replanting these trees that we took out, some of them, and again, the strom grinding sometime in early January.

Good, I appreciate that. Because as valuable as this pathway is going to be to the Park Santiago residents, we know how valuable those sidewalks are for the Cabrillo Park residents who access Cabrillo Park, the Tennis Center, going different ways. And it's a very heavily used pathway. So, great. Thank you for that.

You're welcome.

Phil BacerraItem —

Mr. Mayor?

Yes, go ahead.

Phil BacerraItem —

Well, I want to thank Council Member Sarmiento for pulling the item. I had one question for staff, and that is, I know that previously there have been some concerns expressed by residents as far as having this path available, if there would be any safety concerns. Personally, I love the idea that we're going to actually have this pedestrian connectivity to the trail, through the neighborhoods, and as Council Member Sarmiento called out, the fact that you have multiple neighborhoods that will benefit from this.

Phil BacerraItem —

But speaking to the safety concerns, could you just kind of highlight some of the additional items that came about from those concerns that were expressed?

Certainly, sir. So there were four community input meetings where there were residents that expressed security concerns. And as a result, features were changed for the trail. and they include taller and more aesthetically pleasing green screens along the existing residential wall, new nighttime safety lighting, lockable and more aesthetically pleasing gates to regulate the access, and new park security patrols happening in the area. The pathway and the surrounding areas will look significantly better than they do today. The gates will not be chain-linked, and the path will be secured after dust,

so it won't be open during the nighttime hours.

Phil BacerraItem —

Perfect. I appreciate that. Thank you. And I'd be happy to support this project with, I think, per the comments of some of the community, maybe we incorporate some native plantings. Mr. Mayor?

Yes, Councilman Salodio. Yes, thank you. I do want to thank staff that's been working on this project literally for years. And I see Monica Sutter in the audience. I want to thank you for all this work. Over the years, it started with just the Metrolink project there and eliminating the horns and beautifying that area. and I know that the mayor and I worked on that back then. I do want to point out most of this funding is from a grant, a million dollar grant from the active transportation program. I do like the idea of California native plants, but I think it's also important to to integrate it with other landscaping in the area.

And hopefully we can just work with the neighbors and the association on on what works best. And I know Monica has been working closely. And then finally, there are safety issues in that part of town, largely because of the creek. And so we want to be mindful just as we put this project together and have areas be accessible, that we try to keep issues and vandalism away and open it when it's safe and usable for everybody. We want this to create a better, safer situation for Park Santiago residents, not worse. and I know there's been a lot of good planning already on it. With that, I'll move the item.

Phil BacerraItem —

I'll second.

We have a motion and a second. Those in favor, please press green.

All right, Council Member Sarmiento, you can now go to the conference, I believe. Thank you, and thank you for pulling that item.

Now I'm going to go to two other items, or three others that have been pulled, then we'll consider the balance. Councilor Iglesias, you pulled item 20A, I believe. Do we have any speakers on 20A?

We do not.

Please go ahead.

Okay, so the reason I moved, I'm sorry, I pulled this item is just to ask our city manager on the funding for the 18 police officer positions with this 2.7 million dollars that we get from

I guess the parking at downtown Santa Ana so council member the item before you is there's three separate items the first one is to authorize funding of 18 police officers that equate to an annualized funding cost of 2.7 since we're already mid-year the other two actions are appropriating what we need this year to cover the funding of those 18 officers, which is $1.3 million, and then to also cover funding of unfunded pension liability that was previously charged to the parking fund, which does not have sufficient parking revenues to cover.

The funding that we're recommending the appropriate to come from is from the performance from last fiscal year. We've now got a handle on closing the books. Not only did we have overperformance in our revenue, we came under in our expenditures. So there's money available that doesn't impact your reserves. You have sufficient reserves according to your policy. So we're recommending appropriation adjustments to move the money from the last fiscal year into this fiscal year because your team has worked very hard. We heard you loud and clear on public safety being a priority,

and we are on track to have the highest number of officers on the streets that you've had in 20 years. and originally in the budget we didn't fund all of the vacancies so this is to bring the funding up to match the number of officers that were able to bring in

this fiscal year but is there any other use for this money or does it have to be

strictly just for police well we're recommending these funds transfer in to cover these costs that we have within the police department there are some additional dollars left over from last year some of it you've already appropriated previously but there are other excess ones that we could visit if you have other ideas that you want to use those funds for we can certainly

revisit that I guess my question is is where is this money coming from is it coming from the police department budget or is it coming where is it coming from

it's coming from the closeout of the last fiscal year where you had more money than you anticipated on hand so we're taking it from the last fiscal year closing and transferred it into the police department budget to cover these

two items but that money is coming from the general fund or where's this money coming from it's all it's over performance in the general fund okay so then we have other priorities in the city that we could be using this money for and I just don't feel comfortable that you know you told us when we approved that last budget that you had enough money to be able to operate and be able to carry on the business of the city but now with this i'm understanding that we don't so we i mean that money that we had we could use it for something else at the beginning of the year

we made an estimate as to how many police officer vacancies would be filled you had a total you have So authorized count of officers of 384. You had a total of 348 funded and you had 36 that were unfunded. We made the estimate as to how the hiring was going to progress and what level of funding would be needed. We're over performing on the hiring of officers so we need the additional funds to cover the officers that we've been able to bring on board and that the police chief expects to complete by the end of this calendar year.

Yep, but it's for overtime, almost a million dollars in overtime. So I guess I just have an issue with you telling us that we had enough money to run a good budget for our city. And now we had money unspent, and I believe you may have known that, but you may have not shared with us. I don't know why. and I just find it a little, in a way, untruthful of how our budget is really spent because why all of a sudden we have excess money. So that's just me. I'm not going to ask you to answer, but I just feel it's not right.

I would like to clarify that I cannot anticipate what the year-end results are going to be. We're still closing the books, and we have the information as of now, and we did share with you what we anticipated the excess would be, and you did appropriate some of that money.

David PenalozaItem —

Mr. Mayor, who wants to speak?

Peña Losa and then Becerra.

David PenalozaItem —

Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Madam City Manager, the questions that I had, and I had a whole, left my notes at what I thought was home, went back home, and they were at work. So I don't have them. Anyways, excuse me. Out of the 18 positions that Chief, I guess this question would also be for you, that we're trying to fund here, how many of those have actually been already fulfilled and they're hired? Why doesn't the Chief come on up, please?

I will let the Chief answer that question.

David PenalozaItem —

And the reason I'm asking that question is because every year at the end of the fiscal year, We see, you know, oh, there's, we get the little charts of the personnel across all departments, and we see there's, you know, 30 funded vacancies in the police department. And I know you've been working really hard in hiring, and I appreciate it, and I thank you for that. I know there's a swearing-in ceremony next week, I believe, that you have scheduled, or this week. And thank you for that. But I just, out of the 18 that we're asking for right now, how many of those have a name to it?

to them yes thank you council member of the 18 that we're asking to be funded 10 would be filled by december 23rd of this calendar year of this month so for a total of 50 new hires in calendar year 2019 which has not occurred in at least over 20 years perfect and so we have reached that that

David PenalozaItem —

goal of 50 officers hired in 2019 calendar year, correct? Correct. And how many separations within the police department have we had this year, whether it's retirement, moving to another department, or whatnot? Great question. To date, we have nine total. We anticipate one more

this month for a total of 10. Again, a number that we have not seen in at least seven to 10 years. So the net gain would be 40, 4-0.

David PenalozaItem —

And so we've hired, you said 10, correct, from that 18? We have 10 that are... The specific question was, of the 18 that are being asked to be funded,

how many are allotted or dedicated to be filled?

David PenalozaItem —

Ten of those 18, correct. So I don't want to come back in June, or we're looking at the next year's budget, and see that the police department has eight funded vacancies. And I know you're working hard in hiring, and can we anticipate that those eight are going to be filled within the first part of 2020?

Yes, and then some, actually. If I could add, there's an additional 18 that are unfunded that at some point will be coming back and asking for funding there as well. Again, this action is to fund authorized positions, not to add additional positions above our table of organization that's authorized by the council.

David PenalozaItem —

So we've surpassed the funded vacancies that we had earlier this year when we approved the budget. We surpassed those funded vacancies, and now we're tapping into the unfunded vacancies that we also saw, correct?

That's a correct statement. Our goal was to hire 50 in the calendar year, a very overarching mission, which folks have been working very hard with your support to accomplish, and that's what has occurred.

David PenalozaItem —

So we can anticipate that in the next budget cycle, we will see the police department ask for an additional appropriation to fund the remaining, I believe you said, how many on top of the year? Today would be 18. Today? Yeah. But coming back in June, how many would you be requesting?

Well, we also have attrition to address. We had low attrition this year. Next year, we've benchmarked it will be higher. We typically have seen 25 or so officers leave through natural attrition. The anticipation is we'll be near that number next year. So we'll have additional positions to fill based on attrition as well. So we just have to continue the course and see where we're at. Awesome. Thank you.

Yes. Additional comment, Councilor Bessette, and then Mayor Pro Tem.

Phil BacerraItem —

Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Madam City Manager, so is it safe to say that typically speaking, as you guys are preparing the budget, you guys try to conservatively estimate what the allocations are going to be, correct?

Yes, sir. What we typically do of all the authorized count, we look at realistically how many we think are going to be filled, and we'll fully fund some and we'll partially fund others, and then we won't fund some of them outright. So the chief has just done a spectacular job of bringing in new police officers. So this is a good problem to have.

Phil BacerraItem —

Well, I was just going to say, you underestimated our chief and his department if we're going to frame it, right? I mean, this is not that we have this problem because he's not doing his job or our department's not doing their job. My understanding is from what you said, 384 sworn officers is what we're shooting for, correct?

That's the authorized count, correct.

Phil BacerraItem —

Per this council's direction.

Yes.

Phil BacerraItem —

And so this council's direction was to go with 384 officers. The chief is doing what this council asked him to do, which is hire, hire, hire. He's dealing with attrition. And the money, just so I understand this correctly, so we've got money that was sitting left over from the previous fiscal year. And part of our action tonight is simply just to move it into the same column, but under the 19-20 fiscal year budget, correct? In the general fund, correct. Okay, thank you.

Okay, we have Mayor Pro Tem.

Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Just want to congratulate Chief Valentin for great work recruiting all these fine police officers. He didn't lower the standards. He kept track of what he was doing. He had a plan. He put people in the right places to go out and aggressively go out and seek qualified applicants. And hiring police officers isn't that easy. It's not something you can do overnight. I'm on the Public Safety Committee, and so was Council Member Solorio. And on the average, we lose between 28 to 32 officers a year.

And last year, we only lost nine, correct? I think we have nine right now.

By the way, Councilor Peña-Luz, I think, was also on the Public Safety Committee.

I'm talking about when Jose and I were on there from the beginning. Old school.

We've got this ship on the path. Sorry about that.

Pre-millennial here. So, Chief, how many people did we lose recently this past year?

So we have nine officers have left. We anticipate just one more this year, so a total of ten.

Total of ten. And so we, and I know that we had the big raise, the one that didn't support. And I want to be clear with everyone because I have to keep saying it. I supported a raise that we can afford. Don't support a raise that we can't afford. But we're here and the council voted on it and here we are. So, you know, the system has to keep moving forward. The city needs to keep moving forward. So sometimes these are very, very tough decisions to make when it comes to funding. and it's not like I'm going to stop and just say no and then everything else is going to stop. It doesn't. We have to kind of figure out a way.

And I want to thank you again for the hard work, your men and women of your department going out there and looking for qualified people. Everyone across the nation, by the way, is suffering from qualified applicants that they cannot find enough people to come into police work. So, and Santa Ana Santa Ana is a very active city. We are looking for the best. We asked the chief and I remember continuously, remember Jose and the rest of the members here, Council Member Peñalosa, not to lower the standards. To make sure that if we want to meet the numbers, to make sure that you keep the standards high.

Because Santa Ana is a very, very, Santa Ana Police Department is a very proud police department. And I thank them for their work. and I'm just worried about the mass, you know, exodus of people leaving the department after that race kicks in because it's going to start in April and then we're going to be right back where we started. It's going to be tough. That's what I'm concerned about. You know, they're going to stick around for a while, get that race, and then they're going to retire and then we're going to see 60 people, 80 people, who knows, I don't know what, just leave.

And then we are again trying to bring more qualified people. That's my main concern. And I don't know what's going to happen.

Can you speak to that briefly, please?

Chief, do we have a plan for that?

Do you expect a mass exodus at some point?

So there is, based on age and years of service, we've looked at the officers that we do have, and that's where we anticipate a much higher number of attrition in the area of about 25, maybe 30 for 2020. So what we've done in 2019, essentially we need to duplicate in 2020, and we're prepared to do that. If I could just pause for a brief moment and have Deputy Chief Enrique Esparza stand up. He's here with us tonight. He's the Deputy Chief that I put directly in charge and overseeing the hiring effort. And so I want to acknowledge his hard work. I will say it again.

I'm just kidding. All right. So, anyways, I want to acknowledge him because of his leadership as well. I mean, you set a vision. and we put a strategic plan together, and then there's people that have to get it done. He is in part at the sphere of getting it done.

There was folks up here who didn't think you could do it. So thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you. You guys were, you know, very...

Thank you. You may... Don't go too far. You may be brought up again. Councilor Solario and then Peñaloza.

Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Just some general comments. I do feel that our new city manager is getting a good sense of how the city runs and the history in all departments in budget. But budget projections have been very spotty the entirety of this past two years. About nine months ago, we had our main financial officer saying we're going to definitively end the year $600,000 in the red. And I always said, no, you've got all these unfunded vacancies, everything else. We're now getting closer to $5 million, $6 million surplus from the last fiscal year.

So we obviously could afford the raises back then and this extra staffing. I know it was referenced that we're overperforming on hiring, and we're not overperforming on hiring. We're just on track of the hiring. The chief's intention was always to hire these 50, so that was a known thing. I do want to see our department get to 384 and beyond. but today I still have some questions so I don't know that I'm prepared to support this today. I think I want to see more resources, more officers, but I think the community wants to see more in the areas of

homelessness enforcement and anti-camping. We still have panhandlers everywhere, Santiago Creek's a mess. That's the only public area that still has significant, you know, camping and tents and a criminal element. I know years ago the community was promised 10 officers for community-oriented policing. I think we ought to honor that. Also, as we've been staffing up, we should also now begin to see a decrease in overtime dollars being spent. And you're asking for more staff and more overtime. That's one thing I want more information on is how much do we pay overtime for our average officer?

How do we see that ramping down or what those projections are? I'm also concerned that this is also just an effort to hire the PMA contract that still has not been funded. And so I want to know from our city staff, not today but in the future, or maybe today, how that could be firewall to make sure that happens because I do know there's money elsewhere, but I worry that this is a runaround. I do think that this is a good use of Measure X, so that's all good. And then if we have dollars left over, you know, I want to know where they're going

to go. You know, they should go back to the to the general fund. Also on these remaining dollars, we shouldn't in piecemeal budget, okay, we found these extra dollars, let's give it to one department. We did that earlier, we gave it to multiple departments, as well as it was a standing commitment to any surplus dollars to give to the youth program. We thought we would only have a smaller amount, so we did an earlier chunk. So this time it all going surplus money to PD, you know, isn't in line with that. And then finally, I think it's time for a citywide survey

so that the staff and the council can have a better sense of what our residents want in terms of policing services, park services, etc. I do think that there's a disconnect between the staff and to a lesser extent the council because we're out there a little bit more. But there's a big disconnect with the services and budgeting what we're doing and what the community wants, especially out of Measure X. And so as we move forward, we've got to match that up a little bit better. Thank you.

I think that I thought Councilman Pena Loza had more questions, but he has more pressing business.

He's coming back. And then after that, I'm going to try to get us to vote before we depart. Please go ahead, Council Member.

David PenalozaItem —

I just wanted to clarify what Mayor Pro Temp said, because the first comment, I know he didn't say it, but to me it sounded like it said, the chief lowered the standard. And I wanted to write. Okay, good. And I'm sure that's what he meant, and that's what he said. but I heard I was like wait I hope we didn't lower the standards in hiring so just want good just wanted to make sure that we're keeping that standard high and and and I know there it is hard to hire police officers across the country so thank you for it and appreciate the effort let me just say one word and

then hopefully we we can vote quickly I know we're missing a council member but that is I believe that the contract chief and me you can concur with me on this, that it's been an asset, not only at retaining officers, but also at recruiting. I understand we're getting laterals from Huntington Beach and Fullerton and Anaheim and other cities, which previously had not been the case. So right now, a lot of things have aligned. It's enabled you to do a wonderful job, and you are. And would you concur with those thoughts?

Absolutely. Absolutely. Anything that we can do to recruit and retain is a plus. So in 2017, we inherited 67 vacancies, put a team together to address that with a strategic plan. A good contract came forward, and then this year was the year to accomplish.

And prior to that, even though we tried very hard to hire more, we had nonetheless a growing number of vacancies over the years. We'd hire, we'd lose a few more than we hired, and we'd have three, four every time we were going down. It is the first year in a long time that we've made a strong advance, and hopefully we're in a position to do so again next year. Yes. Thank you for your good work. Thanks. So with that, we have – do we have a motion?

Council Member Solario? I'd like to move to continue for two weeks so we can get some responses to the questions we have.

I'll make a motion to approve. Substitute motion? Substitute motion. Second.

Okay, let's attempt to substitute first. It does require five votes. It does. Those in favor, please vote green.

Mayor, the item will not pass because it requires a supermajority.

And Councillor Solario didn't vote?

Correct, because I have questions. I'd like to move for a two-week continuance so that we can get questions for answers. Until the 17th? Yeah. Okay.

I'll second. All right. Those in favor of the two-week continuance, please vote green.

it passes but you voted no on the continuance got it alright just wanted to make sure so with that motion carries next item I believe is item 20C Councilman Iglesias

okay Christine for this one I just I know it's it's is this a grant that the police department received and we're looking in collaboration with the Homeland Security in order for us to receive

this or it's federal funding associated with the UASI program it's for programs that are geared towards terrorism related so we're basically accepting the money yes this is recognizing the the upcoming receipt of this amount of ground for the federal government I make a motion to approve

Yeah, I just got thrown that it says requires five affirmations, even to receive them. Yes.

Any type of an appropriation adjustment does.

Okay, but this is just, it's a grant. It's not a grant. Okay, I'll second.

Okay, we have motion to second. Those in favor, please press green. Councilor Iglesias seconded the motion.

Okay, it passes. Next item, I believe, is also Councilor Iglesias. Was that 22 Diaz and David?

Okay, we have a speaker, Nestor Correa. You want to speak on 25D and 25E. Please come on down at this time.

Good evening, Mayor and Council Members. My name is Nestor Correa, and I work for the Small Business Development Corporation of Orange County. We own a loft at the Artist Village. We've been here since 2002.

I've only been working here 18 months, and that's the first time I even came to Santa Ana. I've never been to Santa Ana before. Just passed by, went to San Diego. So I've been here 18 months. I joined the Downtown Inc. I'm a board member there, and I'm just very surprised. I've been a board member of a lot of committees, a lot of organizations, and the Downtown Inc. The people are highly organized. They're dedicated and passionate about the city. Plus, they're made up of the residents, business owners, homeowners, and all of us are all volunteers. And during our meetings, we even have other people come in and attend.

So it's open to everybody.

I've only been 19 months but they've successfully done the banners in the artist village area they put those together I've seen different events that have come about here in the city I can't believe it but to me Santa Ana is a destination location and I think a lot of it has to do with what Downtown Inc. is doing these people put events together they don't make a ton of money on them but you know what all the business owners appreciate the people coming in people come from all over the place. I don't live in Santa Ana. I live in Whittier.

But I've been coming out here with my family, enjoying some of the events that we're having here. I think it's great what you're doing here. And if every city in the United States did this, we'd all be a lot more prosperous. So, and hearing the business owners talk about how safe and clean everything is because of what they're doing with the Clean and Safe Program, all the programs they're putting together are very good. So I I hope that the council and everybody passes everything so that way they can continue doing the good work that they're doing here in Santa Ana.

Thank you. Minister, let me just say welcome to Santa Ana. Love your energy. Keep up the good work. And I know Raul is out there and others. Go Downtown Inc. Thank you. Absolutely. Thank you. So with that, I would – do you have a comment, Council Member, please? Because I think you pulled the item, didn't you?

No, I pulled 22.

Okay. So this is 25. So let's go ahead. Could you give me the speaker card? See what you did, Nestor? You took us out of sequence here. So all right. So let's consider 22D after a speech. I'd entertain a motion. Excuse me, 25D as in David. I'd entertain a motion.

Motion to approve.

We have a motion and a second. Those in favor, please press green. Now we're going to go to the item that Councilor Iglesias actually pulled, which is item 22D as in David. Councilor Iglesias, please.

He just voted green. We don't need a little re-vote. Councilor Iglesias.

Okay, so for 22D is a contracts award for office furniture, installation, and related services in the amount of $1.131,240. And it says it's going into different, I guess, into different departments.

and and I see that we have five different providers or I guess vendors that are going to be providing us these the furniture I don't know and I don't I don't think I saw it here maybe I missed it on the council that for the staff report was it identified how much is going into what department and how

much we're spending yes councilmember included in the staff report it lists by city department the approximate amount by each department is in the staff report

and then so what this money is coming from each different department is it a surplus money that we had or what is this it was budgeted for the current

fiscal year the majority of the departments are general funded so a large chunk of it is general fund but there also are some monies that are programmed for the public works portion of their furniture from the sanitation fund and the water fund and then risk management has a separate source of funding as well so was this like kind of like you're saying like surplus money from the last budget or where was this money coming from this these were requests made by the departments during the budget hearing process and they were built into the current year's budget this is not

request for any new money it's basically a request to approve the agreement for

the purchases okay and this was part of the budget that we or that they came

before us right correct the current fiscal year budget okay thanks for those

counselor Solario please yes I do think that this was appropriately budgeted and this is these are just the contracts to implement really a lot of this is deferred need you know there's been years and years that we haven't replaced furnitures or deficiencies in our office environments and it's important that employees have good safe areas to work. I would like to see if with the police department for the dispatch center I do see that there's an interest in buying chairs but when I visited the dispatch center you know about nine months ago or

so or six the walls were torn there was a missing tv no real plants and that's the heart of the pd operation over there and i want to make sure that we make an effort to not just tidy everything up but lift it up a little bit and you know and maybe as part of this overall contract we may be able to

do that. Thank you. A quick question, Councilman Iglesias, please. So now that I was able to open it, for the library, the New Hope Library, it shows the amount of $100,000. And I know that in my request, and I believe Councilmember Soloria too, we've been putting an emphasis on on library. And for us to really make it inviting to the entire community, and I just don't think, I mean we're spending fifty thousand dollars for the city manager's office which hardly anyone visits and then we are spending a hundred thousand dollars

just barely at the library so I don't feel this is adequate I just I just feel that we're not really putting the money into where it's supposed to be I just don't feel comfortable with the appropriation the weights who chose this and I mean how did you guys come up with this I just I I don't I don't I'm not

comfortable with it. All right do I have a motion on the item? I'll make a motion to approve and I just wanted to go ahead is there a second? I'll second with comment. Go ahead make your comment council member. With the in regards to to the

David PenalozaItem —

furniture I mean you it's you just learn a lot you know when the the he has bought the office chairs for the closed session room and I think I asked you know why these bulky office chairs and they said all risk management these are the ones that risk management approved I'm sitting there like oh geez you know but with that said I'm happy to see that at the New Hope library there are getting you desks and bookcases and seating tables and workstations and whatnot and with the city manager's office I see where councilwoman Iglesias is coming from, but I just want to add that that's where anybody who's anybody that wants to do business

David PenalozaItem —

in our city eventually goes and meets with us. Sometimes I'd rather meet them outside City Hall because I'm like, oh, jeez, they're going to say this is the antiquated city we want to do business in. I'll harp on walking into the 1960s every time when I first walked into the eighth floor, so I'm happy to see that. But with that, those are my comments, and thank you. All right. We have a motion and a second. Councilor Becerra.

Phil BacerraItem —

Mr. Mayor, I'll keep it quick. I agree with Councilmember Solorio. I would rather have our employees have a safe place to work and furniture rather than have to discuss claims because of inadequate furniture or workspace. And I do visit the city manager's office, so I don't think it's quite the desolate place that nobody goes to. And as Councilmember Penaloza said, there are quite a few folks that have to go through your office. And one thing I want to applaud our city manager in regards to this item is I took the opportunity,

Phil BacerraItem —

like many of my colleagues do, and I asked the city manager on a number of the consent calendar items today, rather than pull them all off the calendar, I had the opportunity to talk to her about this one. And I applaud the fact that I had asked her about the fact that these five companies were not from Santa Ana, and I was a little bothered by that. But she informed me that the whole purpose of this particular item was to actually give us a cost savings by working with these folks, piggybacking off of other existing contracts. So with that, Madam City Manager, thank you, and ready to vote when you are, Mr. Mayor.

Thank you. Really quick, Mr. Mayor.

David PenalozaItem —

Yes, go ahead. Just to piggyback a little bit on Council Member Bacerra. we've had this before where I see the breakdown of different vendors that we choose in other cities and sometimes the difference is only for $5, $10 $30 and we've addressed that in the past. We should be shopping in our city and using local vendors so let's always keep that in mind. Even if the savings are under $500 or, you know, it's, I don't think it's substantial enough to go out of the city. So those are just my two cents.

Thank you. And before we vote, I just want to note that I believe none of this money is going into the mayor's office, which is an antiquated office, and I like it that way. So it's not the right office for risk management and everything else. I know I had a mayor visiting recently from Ensenada, Mexico, and he commented that it was very nice to see an authentic office of the era. That's what he said, an authentic office of the era. So if anybody wants to visit, you're welcome to visit the mayor's office anytime. Yes, Council Member Iglesias, go ahead.

I just don't want them to be a misunderstanding, and Council Member Becerra, I do look at the agenda and I do ask questions. So I don't know who you were referring that comment to. But what I wanted to ask the city manager was, I'm not against what you're doing here. I'm just saying $100,000 for the library is nothing compared to $50,000 to, in my opinion, an office that hardly anyone of the community visits. It's half of it. Why can't we put more money into the library? That's why I was asking who chose this amount.

The $100,000 is for New Hope, so it's not for your main library.

And New Hope needs a lot of remodeling. It's old. It's old, so that's what I'm saying. I think it's just a little bit.

And in addition to the furniture purchases, there is a lot happening at New Hope, as well as renovations and improvements. They're just not in the staff report because this is furniture purchases.

All right, we're going around in circles a little bit here. Council Member Solario?

Just to add a little bit more to, I think, the context that Councilwoman Iglesias is trying to provide is we have other pots of money, like $4 to $5 million that we now have in that youth fund. And we need to find dollars to support things that the community needs, parks, anti-homeless stuff. We should have an urgency to be programming that youth money, and I don't see it. We made mention before that the Youth Commission is going to help program that. I think two or three meetings ago I suggested maybe the Parks Commission can also recommend how to use some of those dollars.

We don't want that precious money that we set aside to help youth and libraries to just sit in a fund. We want to put our resources to work and I'm all for the employees and we should do it, but we can do things parallel and youth services and dealing with the homeless stuff. libraries are big priorities in town and again this is another example where staff just doesn't always prioritize community needs so they get what they

want thank you all right I think enough comment on this those in favor please press screen motion carries with that I believe we're now on the consent calendar I mean the balance of it I'll move it I just we have a motion is there Second. I just want to note for the record, I'm going to abstain on item 25A. It's a contract with West Coast Arborists. I did some work with them some time back. They were a source of income. So I'm going to abstain from that item.

Phil BacerraItem —

Mr. Mayor, can we just do two motions then?

I think I can just do what I said. Is that sufficient? Is that fine?

David PenalozaItem —

Can I pull item 25A for a separate vote? That way it's simple.

We can. Either way, it's simple. Just vote yes. I'm going to vote yes on the motion, on the balance. So those that want the balance, please press green.

Who seconded?

Becerra seconded that. So you're not going to let us vote until you figure out who seconded it. See how they hold us off? This is why they like the lights. All right. So with that, I believe we're on to next item, which is 55A. Is that correct? I would entertain a motion on 55A.

Don't everybody talk at once.

I'll approve.

I'll second. Those in favor, please press green.

Okay. Item 55B. It's a motion to adopt an authorized submission of the fiscal year M2 year and expenditure report. Motion to approve. Those in favor, please press green.

Item 55C, it's a resolution approving the water supply assessment from A-Place Mall.

Second.

We have a motion to second. Those in favor, please press green.

All right.

So, item 60A, a resolution of bringing a site plan review. Move the item. We have a motion.

A second with comment. Second with comment. Okay, go ahead.

Phil BacerraItem —

Part of my, I love this project. I think it's great that we're introducing housing to the downtown. One of my concerns, though, in regards to this particular project is, You know, while we saw the folks that have been pushing for preservation of many major key components of our heritage in our downtown, as this project moves through the process, what we've seen here, what's that?

Go ahead. I think we're about to approve this project, but the clerk just handed me four speakers, so we ought to give them a chance to speak.

Phil BacerraItem —

Well, then, Mr. Mayor, I'll hold my comments until...

Hold your comment. We have a motion to second.

come up and speak and realize that all you can potentially do is talk us out of it. So with that, Adam Wood, if you're here and you want to speak, come on down. Micah Tardif, Tim Rush, and Rola Yannis.

Go ahead.

Evening, Adam Wood, Building Industries Association. Support it.

That's a good speech.

It was succinct, passionate, got down to the point, even had a thumbs up. Michael, come on down. Raul, if you're there, come on down, Raul. And Tim, I know you're right behind him. Go ahead, Mike.

Good evening, Mayor and City Council. This development would include the historic 1931 Orange County Title Company building. The Orange County Title Company became what is today the iconic Santa Ana-based First American Company. It is understood by most that the beautiful Art Deco style of the facade remains behind the metal cladding. The Art Deco facade was not removed as it is incorporated into the structure. The art history and culture are one with the structure. The Art Deco style had an important impact on architecture and design worldwide in the 1920s, 30s, and 40s.

In Mexico City, many of the city's highly recognized Art Deco structures were severely damaged during the 2017 earthquake. There is an effort underway to return these buildings to their original glory, much of which had been chipped away by insensitive updates over the decades, even before the earthquake struck. Architects and planners are scouring historic photographs and records to rebuild them.

It would be a shame to lose one of historic downtown Santa Ana's few Art Deco treasures to an Irvine-style development, while other major cities proceed to rebuild and preserve that same art history and culture. It will be said that historic groups have agreed to a plan which might preserve only a portion of the building and facades. I say might because the agreement includes the term, if feasible, and it is left largely up to the developer's discretion to determine feasibility.

The developer in the reports before you has disparaged both this fine historic structure and San Ana's first American company as not historically significant. The architectural rendering presented with this partial facade plan is not complementary to either the art of the original structure or to the Irvine-style development itself. I don't believe that this developer has any intention of finding preservation of two partial facades as feasible.

Bottom line, if this development is approved as it is presented to you tonight, the developer is guaranteed his Irvine-style development and the art, history, and culture of historic downtown Santa Ana and Orange County are guaranteed only a shiny nameplate which declares that something wonderful once stood here.

Please delay the implementation of the approvals for this development for further investigation and discussions, which I believe should lead to making the entire historic and beautiful 1930s Art Deco Orange County Title Company building a shining jewel of this development and historic downtown Santa Ana. I will just add that this development is a major violation of the Santa Ana Transit Zoning Code as regards preservation of the historical character of the entire downtown area, not just the National Historic District. Thank you.

Thank you, Mike. Raul? Followed by Tim.

Good evening, Mayor, members of the council. My name is Raul Yanez. You know that.

I've been a business and property owner in the downtown for the last 40 years. How many? 40. 40, yeah. Not 40. 40. 40, 40.

Yeah, that's right. Keep going.

Last September. You got it. I've turned 40 years, yeah. Anyway, downtown business are struggling, and I believe that the project, like the Thor Brothers, will be a great benefit to the area.

the project will bring over 300 new residents who will shop in the downtown because the project will include retail stores as well as restaurants and on the street level it will bring additional visitors to the area. So let's welcome Toll Brothers to the city with open arms. And I support this project and I hope you will do so as well. Thank you, Raul. Thank you. Thank you. Tim?

Good evening, Mr. Mayor, council members. As you know, I've been down here for a long a number of times on this project and we initially i'm here on behalf of preserve orange county and representing the preservation community and yes i echo the comments of to a degree of mike tardif no we're not happy about having to see two historic buildings destroyed the old albert sheets Cafe, which is period commercial retail, next to the beautiful grand Art Deco Orange County

title building. But the fault for that lies squarely with city staff. And that is what I would hope that you will address going forward. City staff needs to design a process where the preservation community is brought in at the beginning, not at the ass end of the process. because what we have here now is we're practicing facadism. And what we're winding up with is a facade-ectomy. Now, I'm not real happy about that, and I've taken plenty of beatings from Mike and other people in the preservation community.

But aside from filing a lawsuit and stopping the development and holding it up for a year and a half,

I felt that maybe the best compromise was what we have today which is where Toll Brothers agreed to hire a preservation architect to partner with them and to incorporate the facade of the Orange County Title Building into their new development and to do it tastefully and respectfully. And I do believe that it's going to make their project a landmark, a new landmark, and one that will make it a destination in town. But the victim here was Toll Brothers and the preservation community.

Had we been brought in at the beginning, we wouldn't have wound up with this awful sausage of facade-ectomy. and Phil I know you served on the historical commission and others of you here on the council appreciate what our historic downtown means it's just unfortunate the staff doesn't share that same vision and I hope that'll change

going forward thank you thank you for your comments Tim and for all the work you do over the years and all things you volunteer on. So with that, I would entertain...

Phil BacerraItem —

Mr. Mayor, we have a motion in a second. Yes, we do. Go ahead. I'd just like to comment.

Phil BacerraItem —

This particular project is kind of one of those textbook cases of perfect compromise. And what's also very interesting is that every speaker that came up to talk about this project all had something very insightful to add. Tim is actually very correct. Mr. Tardif, you're absolutely right about trying to treasure what we have here. And I think that looking at all the work that Mike McCann and Toll Brothers have done to bring this project into downtown, I'm really happy to see that we're going to see a new mixed-use project. I don't like the idea that we're practicing facadism,

Phil BacerraItem —

and I do think that staff really needs to kind of tighten the bolts to make sure that we don't allow folks to come into town and think that we don't care about our resources, that we don't care about our assets. But having said that, I am in support of this project. But one thing I do want to kind of tweak on the conditions of approval, if I may, I'm actually going to rescind my second and offer a substitute motion, which would be to approve the project before us. But what I really want to see is on condition number 10, where it says the professional should have experience in architectural historic preservation,

Phil BacerraItem —

I'd like to see that change to the professional shall have experience in architectural historic preservation. It's not a should. It should be a shall.

Is there an additional to the motion, or is that the motion?

Phil BacerraItem —

Well, one more item. And that is under condition 10A, toward the end of the paragraph, we have the idea that the developer is going to just provide a report to staff and tell the preservation community that the report's there, and voila, they're the judge, jury, and executioner, and on they go. I would appreciate that if we had some language in there, and I'll defer to staff if there's better language, but I want something in there that doesn't just give all the cards, the whole deck, and the whole table over to the developer.

Phil BacerraItem —

I appreciate everything that the developer is doing, but I think there should be a little bit of checks and balances here as to what we see once they do the removal of the skin and we see what the Art Deco facade underneath looks like.

Let's just accept those as friendly amendments.

So let's go with the original motion, but these are amendments to the original motion.

Phil BacerraItem —

If I may ask staff, I really want to kind of drill down on this for 10A. I don't want to come back later and have somebody say we didn't put a should or a shall somewhere we should have.

Thank you. Understanding those concerns, I'd like to read out probably a sample language for 10A to add at the end that the planning and building agency shall complete the review and determine the feasibility of the historic preservation alternative and notify the above listed parties and the developer within 10 days. So that place the responsibility of determining that on staff in addition to, and not just the developer, as you mentioned.

Phil BacerraItem —

So the developer would provide the report, and built into this, the planning community, I'm sorry, the preservation community would be present as they do some of this work to discover the condition of that facade.

It will be our responsibility to notify the preservation community.

Phil BacerraItem —

Well, notify it and review the report, not just accept it.

Correct.

Phil BacerraItem —

Okay, and that would be very acceptable.

Counselor, I just want to make sure when the society participate, if they have a real problem, I want you to bring it to council and say, wait a minute, we somehow can't determine something. If they're happy, you're happy, developer's happy, architect's happy, we don't need to hear about it. But we need that feedback if there is a problem. Councilor Iglesias, please.

Okay. So it's going to be my generic questions that I ask regarding the parking. What's the parking ratio per unit?

So the parking ratio for this project is at 1.51. This is a project that is located in the downtown transit zoning code. The Downtown Transit Zoning Code is a development code area that look at and encourages development that are mixed use in an urban environment that is near transit-based, multimodal opportunity. Downtown is a perfect example of that. It includes walking. It includes access to buses, the new streetcars that are coming through. So those are all opportunities for reduction of parking requirements.

in addition to that this project although not required the developer is proposing a 5% affordable housing at very low income level and by proposing that going through the state law it allows for at least three concession and also a number of waivers in order to development the project so as part of that they are proposing 1.51 parking spaces per unit.

And I get that, Min, and I like your justification. I think it's the same reason you gave me for the ones with, you know, when you have the density bonus. But just because they can doesn't mean that we should. And I just feel that if we're asking for one developer, why are we lowering the bar or lowering our standards for another developer? And seeing this is where I just get sick to my stomach. We treat people differently. I think if we're going to be doing this, we need to be doing it across the board. And if we're requesting 2.0 for other developments, we should be doing the same for this.

So we are following the law, and the law allows for the reduction of parking spaces. However, in anticipation of such concern and any unanticipated, we work with the developer to implement a parking management program to where, if necessary, they can increase the parking capacity on site by an additional 80 spaces, which will bring it up to about 1.83 spaces. And in addition to that, if it's necessary, they also have access to city parking structure, which they will require at least an additional 70 spaces, which will bring it up to 2.19. With that, it actually meets the transit zoning code standard,

actually exceeded by 0.4 spaces.

But we're using city resources. I mean, I'm not going to change my vote. I just feel that it's something that we have different expectations for different people. And one thing that I want to say about this project, and I don't even know if it's a, I have no idea who the Toll Brothers are. I'm very disappointed that I've been on this council for almost a year.

And about three weeks ago, I was approached by the consultant of this project to meet with me. I mean, what an insult. I mean, I've been on this, so it's kind of like, okay, I already have the boats, I don't even have to meet with everybody. So it's just for me, I just feel that we need to have some standards, some priorities, some requirements of individuals that want to do business in the city that, you know, just give us common courtesy. and I just feel that this project is, you know, like we had 25-25, we had the residents come in and oppose their, not oppose, but share their concerns.

The same we've had with the historical commission, and I know their concerns are valid, and why aren't we doing the same thing for them, and why aren't we postponing this project? I don't know. That's just a question for my colleagues, but I just feel that we don't do everything fair across the board for everyone that comes into our community and into our city. So this is just me moving forward. I just feel that any project that needs to be approved for me is, I think it's also dance. It's what, how many stories? Seven stories?

Seven and five.

Yeah, so it's high. I mean, we went from, you know, in 2525, we went from six to four, and it's still high. So, and in downtown Santa Ana, it's, you know, I think it'll be one of the highest buildings for right now. And then we're going to encourage others. I know the federal building is the highest, but, you know, when it comes to dwelling in apartments, I just feel we're just allowing it for other people to tell us how to run our city. And this is, like you were saying, we allow other people to run our cities. And this is, for me, it's one of the projects that I just don't feel comfortable with.

All right. Let me make a couple comments, and I'll continue with the council. I'm very comfortable with this project, and let me tell you why.

We have a streetcar right next to it. We don't need cars, cars, cars all the time. I know 2525 does not have a streetcar next to it. They can't avail themselves of it. But in this case, I believe they will. And we have to take that into account as we design our city and as we move forward. Planning standards have to be taken in context. One size does not fit all. As it relates to the historical study, I do agree that they have to be brought in at the front end, and they were not. But this did not occur under our city manager's watch. She came into this project.

It was already way down the line, about to be wrapped up. But hereforth, I think anything that's historical, in the beginning, we should have input. Also, I would note that the Planning Commission continued to cite them because of the historical issue. It was more than a month that they went and they hammered out this compromise. Maybe it's not a perfect compromise, but it was hammered out. and I do believe that when you look at the downtown, this is a nice mix. I mean, we just had Raul Giannis, a guy that's been around 40 years

and there's a lot of others around there, Raul, that would agree with you that want to see this project because you have retail on the first floor, not only on First Street. I mean, I guess it's a side street, Bush, and Ford Street. That's quite a bit of retail mixed in with the residential. and it's a quality project. And yes, some of the buildings are lower, but you're not looking down at any single family residence here. You're looking at other businesses. You're looking at parking structures. And there is a parking structure right across the street, which I believe is going to be used by guests

and people that are coming to visit this development. So I think it's a quality project. I like the density. I have no problem with the height in that context. The federal building is right down the street. That's 235 feet. It's much, much higher. I hope that this, along with 3rd and Broadway, and hopefully that will come to the city council soon, that huge parking structure that's right in that area, when that gets built out, that's going to be an iconic development as well. High density with residences, with retail, with a hotel. it's really going to invigorate the downtown. So those are my comments now.

But Councilman Solorio, Peñalosa, and then Vacerra.

Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Largely ditto to your great comments. We're starting with the preservation issues. Absolutely agree. That should have been earlier. We knew that those were iconic historic buildings, and it is too bad we got started too late on that. This is going to be next to the streetcar, so that's exciting. and so I do think it's appropriate the density, the height, and we are a quote-unquote built-out city, so really it's about going up, which I know the mayor has strongly been advocating for these past 10 years or so on most projects, and this is one of them.

I think, too, the transit code that we worked on quite a bit and that we postponed that a few times for additional revisions, and I remember Councilman Peñalosa and Iglesias were also wanting to take a second look at that to tighten up a lot of the parking management and related issues, and I think this project has benefited from the previous project management plans that we've worked on, the transit code, the shared parking opportunities nearby, so that's all good. But I especially appreciate that they went out of their way to talk to the residents, and they came up with things like because of the dogs again they needed a

little area for extra you know dog park or places you know for folks to walk their dogs and so within their property on the first floor there's there's an area for dogs and I think that's awesome and then to see local love you know business owners and the two downtown associations especially you know business owners like Jose Ramo and and Mr. Yanez being here thank you for the support. This is going to be a nice symbiotic relationship between residential and small business, and so that is fantastic, and that's why I am very supportive of this project. Thank you.

David PenalozaItem —

Okay, Councillor Peñalosa, I believe. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I just wanted to state that I'm very supportive of this project just because when you look at all the events that happen in downtown, all the merchants, even just, not an event, but just your random Friday night. You have your west end of the downtown area that, as we younger people say, it's lit, and then you have a street of darkness until you get to the east end, and I think that this is going to really help just bring life to that part of downtown and connect the two areas.

David PenalozaItem —

I do agree a lot with what Councilmember Becerra said and what Mr. Tardif said and what Tim said. It's unfortunate that the Historic Preservation Society wasn't brought in a lot sooner. And yeah, I also concur with Tim that I put a little bit of that blame on staff. We have a planning commissioner that serves on the Historic Resources Commission. I feel for that purpose and we should give, still we should look more into that of how we could, you know, if there is going to be a lot of work done to historic buildings or this project for example, we should

David PenalozaItem —

you know, look closer into that before we send the applicants down this rabbit hole of red tape and applications and meetings and because then you have these roadblocks and this opposition that is valid. We don't want to be just single-handedly destroying our downtown. I thank the applicant. I reached out to them and forced them to take me inside of the building and realized that there really wasn't much.

David PenalozaItem —

It's a nice building, but I'm hoping that with the scaling back, if there is a historic facade down there. We preserve it and I'm happy that they made that change to their renderings and the architectural side of it on 5th and Main. I'm happy that I had a part with that, making sure that there was even tiered retail component on Bush and 4th. I'm happy to see that. I wanted a rooftop bar, but that was impossible. But the terrace and the restaurant that's going to hopefully restaurant, who knows,

David PenalozaItem —

but that's going to really activate that area of town. So I'm supportive. And those are my comments, Mr. Mayor.

Thank you. I think, Councilor Becerra.

Phil BacerraItem —

Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Well, the mayor pretty much said a lot of what I wanted to say, which was...

Say it again.

Phil BacerraItem —

I'll be much more brief. the fact that with your leadership and this council's advocacy of the streetcar downtown, I'm looking forward to seeing that thing rolling down 4th and 5th Street in a couple of years. And it's going to be a welcome addition with this project. The density next to the transit, I mean, that's a winning formula. We're seeing it in cities across America. And there have been businesses in downtown, and those of you that patronize downtown or have your businesses in downtown know that it would help to have nearby residential folks

Phil BacerraItem —

that can just walk down to your restaurant, to your shop, and this would bring in that added population that downtown really needs. Another thing is this project, unlike 2525, is not next to single family homes. This is in a downtown. There are certain residential developments in our downtown today that when you rent a unit from those properties, you have to sign a disclaimer that says, I know I'm in a downtown. I know there's going to be activity past 6 p.m. or 8 p.m. It's supposed to be an urban environment, so people are expected to walk, take transit, enjoy a nightlife. So I think this will be a welcome addition.

Phil BacerraItem —

I do want to concur with Councilmember Iglesias.

She left. Damn.

Phil BacerraItem —

I was going to say, you know, one thing I do concur with her about is I'm not a big fan of the state density bonus law and the way that it essentially tries to usurp local zoning authority from city councils like us. The state has enough on its plate, but sometimes they like to wade into our waters and try to kind of tell us how we should govern locally. We are the second-dentest city in California. I feel like we've done a pretty good job when it comes to density. So that's another discussion for another day. With that, Mr. Mayor.

Okay, I believe we have a motion and a second. Go ahead, Councilor Pena Loza. I believe you meant to say the country, not California.

Phil BacerraItem —

No, no, I'm sorry. We are the second-dentest. Fourth in the country, second in the state. Yeah, we're just above Chicago.

David PenalozaItem —

Okay, and just for clarification, I know Councilmember Solorio mentioned that I had some concerns with the transit zoning code when we approved it earlier this year. That was because, for those who remember, there was language throughout the whole thing that said these changes applied were citywide. And I had to pump the brakes a little bit and make sure that that language was cleaned up and staff did and even gave us colorful maps that really outlined this area. So thank you for that.

Okay, we have a motion and a second. Those in favor, please press green.

I'm sure it's going to pass, so let's go on to the next item. Congratulations. Let's move forward. Move forward. So with that item, is it 60?

60B. I'd like to nominate Cecilia Aguinaga to remain on the vector control.

I'd second that motion. What's the motion? Cecilia wants to keep chasing cockroaches, and we're saying go, go, go.

Phil BacerraItem —

Puddles of water? We're good. Right.

So the item calls for either a two- or four-year appointment. Do you want to clarify?

It's a four-year appointment.

Okay, thank you.

Four-year appointment. You okay with that, Cecilia?

I love it.

She wants a tenure appointment.

I want to keep my city safe.

We want you to keep our city safe, Cecilia.

We're out of time. Just watch out for this brain. So that's number two, right? Yeah, option two.

Option two. So we have motion and a second on Cecilia.

Those in favor, press green.

Congratulations, Cecilia.

Good luck to you.

We're glad you go to all those vector control meetings.

60C, we have Alexander. Come on down and speak, please.

Hello, good evening, council and mayor. I'm Alexander. I'm a supporter of the recall committee against Juan Villegas. The role of Mayor Pro Tem is up for appointment, and it's in the best interest of the city and its residents to have a new appointment. Mr. Villegas is not a good representative of the city of Santa Ana. In fact, how can a person that publicly supports Donald Trump and his anti-immigrant policies be the Mayor Pro Tem for Santa Ana? Mr. Villegas has multiple incidents related to alcohol abuse, which have been documented by two contacts by Orange County.

Madam City Attorney, is this appropriate?

Months ago?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

During public comment, we have to...

No, it's not public comment. He's talking about the re-election of Mayor Pro Tem.

60 C.

And he's going a little bit into personal allegations.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

I understand, and I understand that they're difficult. I would ask it. You may ask him to be respectful and to refrain from making those comments.

Please be as respectful as you can and try not to be personal.

Okay, so months ago, there was a recall paperwork that was filed against Mr. Villegas. He interfered and obstructed the process, causing huge exposure and ultimately litigation in which the city of Santa Ana, its taxpayers, agreed to settle the case and pay $40,000 in fees because the city failed to perform their public duty. Mr. Villegas has attended the White House multiple times and most recently during Hispanic Heritage Month. without shame in support of President Donald Trump. Please consider this appointment seriously and appoint a person of integrity that stands for its residents,

not one that supports a presidency that attacks our immigrant community. Appoint a person that is lawful, respectful on staff, and does not break the law or illegally interfere in city matters.

Okay, Mr. Alexander. Anybody else? Seeing nobody else, I'll bring it to council for consideration. I believe that this was appropriate at the previous council meeting, although even then I would believe that we already voted for this when we did the two-year term of Mayor Pro Tem Villegas. But at this point, any other opinions, any motions, anything to consider?

David PenalozaItem —

I would like to make a motion to nominate myself to serve as Mayor Pro Tem.

and I would like to nominate myself to continue to serve because I was voted unanimously by a full council at the time.

Mr. Mayor, we're missing a couple of people. I don't know if it makes sense to instead continue this or...

Or take no action. We had a motion by Councilman Pena Loza. Is there a second to that motion? If there is none, it dies for lack of a second. Is there a second to Mayor Pro Tem's motion?

Phil BacerraItem —

I'll second with comment, or question, actually. So per our charter, it says that the first meeting after the election of a council member, that this is something to consider. Madam City Attorney, could you clarify whether this is something that we absolutely have to consider? I mean, given that what the mayor said, that the current mayor pro tem was nominated and voted unanimously as pro tem for a two-year term. So is there any sort of requirement that we even act on this?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

In my legal opinion, and after doing significant research on a historical basis, I believe, as the mayor indicated, that this was placed on the agenda as an interpretation that it should be placed before you. But with respect to whether you have to do something, that's completely within the discretion of the City Council. You don't have to do anything. You don't not have to do anything. With respect to the Mayor Pro Tem, it is up to the discretion of the City Council.

Thank you.

Additional comment?

If you want to bring Council Member Iglesias in here, then we'll do a vote.

I don't mind if she's around. If not, we can go on to the next item until she returns.

If she's in the bathroom, Commander Gaminski, use your discretion.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

I would like to just inform the council that you do have a prior minute action as confirmed through the city clerk's office. You have an existing minute action that made an appointment for a term of two years. So technically, you don't need a new vote to change that action.

If we take no vote, the previous action would prevail. But if Commander Gaminski is successful, we'll consider. Meanwhile, why don't we, let's move on to item 65A. May we can agree on that? I want to entertain a motion on 65A.

Phil BacerraItem —

Motion to approve. Second.

Those in favor, please press green. Just the calendar.

65B. I'm thinking a little more time, maybe not be a bad idea. Can we do 30 days on this one?

David PenalozaItem —

Sure.

All right. So we have a motion to continue 35B for 30 days. Second.

I was going to make it by you. I'll make it.

You'll make it second by Becerra. Those in favor, please press green. In the meantime, we're all going to look more at this e-pluribizunum and should it be stacked or linear here or elsewhere or whatever. All right. Motion carries.

Item 75, is it A at this point? Do we have any speakers on that item?

All right. Nonetheless, to make the city attorney happy and to comply with the law, we're going to go ahead and open up the public hearing and seeing no speakers I'm going to close the public hearing on 75A and bring it back to council for consideration. Mr. Mayor motion to approve. Mayor pro tem seconds that motion Those in favor, please press green. Motion carries. Item 75B is in Boyan. Any speakers on this item?

Okay, I'm going to open up the public hearing. And Nestor Correa, you're on a roll. You want to speak again. Is Nestor here or he went home? If he went home, he's a smart man. So with that, I'm going to close the public hearing and bring it to council for consideration on 75B. Second. Those in favor, please go ahead and press green.

Motion carries.

75A is Council Member Iglesias. Why don't we go to 75B and call on Council Member Solario, please.

You mean 85A and B?

85B, I mean. Because 85A is Iglesias and Peñalosa. Unless you want to take up 85A. And they're both related, so either way. Go ahead.

David PenalozaItem —

Go ahead. Let's start.

David PenalozaItem —

So 85A is to discuss and consider, direct and city manager to direct staff to study the feasibility of a dog park at 2525 north maintenance right we're looking for a homeless shelter site too so that's right we have just low density um i don't know how the neighborhood would feel about a homeless shelter next to there all

right we have a speaker do you want to hear a speaker sure chris schmidt and councilwoman iglesias

David PenalozaItem —

I know Councilmember Soloria has spoken in support of a dog park eventually, and Councilwoman Iglesias as well. I'm sure all my colleagues like dogs, so go ahead.

Good evening, Mayor, City Councilmembers. I'm excited to see this agenda item tonight. It's been years that I've been hoping we could have a dog park. One point in time, the city discussed opening a dog park off of 22 in Bristol. It wasn't the best location. I've been to several dog parks in Orange County. I don't go to one because I saw a dog get attacked there the one in Costa Mesa is a dirt lot I actually go to Laguna dog park off of Laguna Canyon Road so I fully support this item I'd like to suggest there's some land in the back of Centennial Park that I think would be an ideal

location for a dog park in our city and I hope you guys support that as well so thank you very

David PenalozaItem —

much see you all later okay let me come back to Councillor Penalosa please thank you mr. Mr. Mayor, thank you, Chris, for those comments. I have to agree. The closest dog park to Santa Ana residents, I have a 90-pound dog that I like taking to dog parks, and the closest one, I believe, to me, is the Costa Mesa dog park, and it is a dirt lot, and I never go there because of just how filthy it is, and it's not really a park. They just chained up a dirt lot. And I do frequent the Laguna Canyon one and Irvine dog park as well. because those are the other two that are nice.

David PenalozaItem —

I think it's much needed.

David PenalozaItem —

Much needed in just parks in general in our city, whether it's people park or dog park. But I would like to see a dog park in our city. There's a huge population with dogs. We all love animals, dogs I hope we do.

David PenalozaItem —

And I just would like to see this. I eventually looked into. I know I've had discussions with you, Madam City Manager, since we took that ride on your first night here as City Manager back in May. And I told you about my dreams of eventually seeing a dog park in our city where I could take Jacks to run and hang out. And so I'm hoping that we could look into that. Not sure if you guys can. Council Member.

If I may, I have a comment. Then Solario, then we can take Becerra. I just want to suggest the idea of potentially having more than one. Maybe if there's a pocket here and a pocket there, it's a big city for some people. If it's closer to their neighborhood, it might be easier for them to frequent it more often. Let's start with one. I get it right now. We have zero. But as you're looking at the city, consider potential pockets of parks. It doesn't have to be a huge area. It can be an area that needs to be enclosed so people can let their parks run around.

I mean, their dogs run around and they can have a lot of fun. I think it's healthy for the dogs as well. Some of these dogs don't really get a chance to run around. They get taken out on walks, but then that's it. then they go back home. So anyways, if you would consider that as just a friendly comment and

amendment to the thought. Councilmember Solario. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. And again, really 85A and 85B are connected quite a bit. What I've started to see too is we get grants for park improvements. You know, we have this great social media team now, an email team, so everybody is seeing stuff. Other parks and neighborhoods say, well, what about us? Can I get security cameras? Can't I get, you know, pathway improvement? Can I get this or that? And I had Fisher Park in particular and others that said, how do we get a grant? What can we do?

And so I kind of suggested that I would work with staff and them on a wish list. And a wish list also begins just kind of by what's doable, what's affordable at our existing parks that are newer, what are we doing for additional amenities, and having others pick what they might want. That includes large or small dog park areas. It may be just poles with doggy bags because folks need plastic bags, degradable bags, to take care of their dog needs, security cameras, new lighting, trees, landscaping,

children play areas, exercise equipment, walk paths. Also, too, what's happened in the past, too, is, and it happened up in Santiago Park, where there was a beautiful, large, long slide that kids and teenagers enjoyed forever. And because of deferred maintenance, somebody cut their finger pretty badly to get rid of that liability issue. We removed that big slide, historical, and never replaced it. And so we also have areas through many parks where we have to replace restroom doors, restroom lights, slides, other play equipment.

And we, I think, via our staff and Parks and Rec, and as we're looking at next year's budget, need to spread out the love to all our parks and ask them what they might need. And again, I think part of it is what's working and what's cost effective at our other parks. for example, the special security cameras and lighting in particular, and restroom improvements and other amenities. Thank you.

Thank you. Further comments?

These four, and I apologize, 85A or 85B?

David PenalozaItem —

We started with 85A, but they're similar.

So this is 85A? 85A. The visibility for a dog park? Okay. And I don't know if this was discussed and I apologize. I had to step out. I had to take a call and then talk to my son.

But the feasibility for a dog park, I don't know if it was brought up. My recommendation and my ask would be if we could do a dog park at Centennial Park. There's a land that I believe the police department uses right next to where the offices are for the Parks and Rec staff. staff and I believe that was deeded by the Department of Education to its educational purposes. But we could go back, my understanding, and we could go, you know, we could ask Ron,

I don't think he's here today. But, where is he? Ron Ono is always here. So, the, I guess,

I guess maybe the swap from one agency to the other, if that's something that is feasible, because what I would like is for us to have a dog park at Centennial Park. I feel it's a great location. It's right next to the riverbed, and it's very appropriate for those that are using the riverbed for a walk. And, you know, we could also, and we have enough parking.

That should be easy. Centennial Park should be easy. I think we should have more than one, but let's start there.

So if we could start there to really link into it, what we could do.

How many acres are you thinking, Council Member? Do you have a thought on that?

I think the land is, what is it, three acres, Ron? I don't know. Can you come up to the...

Can it be smaller than three acres and still be a successful dog park?

Those are standard sizes for large and small dog parks, but this is just a discussion item, so I would... Come back with options.

Yes. So with options on where to do it, but specifically Centennial Park, what's the acreage on that one?

The area that's currently dirt in the southwest corner is around four acres.

Okay.

But as you were discussing dog parks, we are planning on doing a master plan of all our park sites, and that will be one of the items to consider as to where is the proper location for a dog park as we go through this master plan process. Just for your information, several years ago, we were looking at a dog park location, and several suggestions came up, and we considered them, and our concern was you can't just place a dog park in a small parcel, because especially if it's in a residential area, it may cause a problem with noise and maintenance and all that.

So we're looking at larger sites, possibly. And one of the sites, I believe one of the councilmen mentioned, or someone mentioned that it was a location on Bristol and the 5 Freeway, where we had actually got permission from the state to develop one. There's a concept plan on that, but never materialized because of funding.

But the land is still there, right?

But the land is still there. The problem with that site, though, if you consider it a problem, you would have to drive to it. It's not a walk-to site that you would normally have at a larger site.

So if we could start with, I would say, like a pilot starting it at Centennial Park in that parcel there, that would be good if you could bring back options on what we could do with that land and what an adequate dog park could be. Because I know they have one in Costa Mesa. I don't know how big that is, that site. And then I know Anaheim has one, and it's kind of small. But it's, yeah. So I would want something like for big dogs and also for, you know, something.

Let me ask a question, then go to Solario. How long would it take for you to come back with your master plan when you're looking at the city, including Centennial Park?

Want to answer that?

Executive Director, Ms. Redloff.

Council members, a parks master plan, which this city has never had, is a comprehensive study of our entire park system. So in addition to dog parks, people want skate parks, people want tennis courts and ball fields and such. That takes about a year to do that, and it includes the community. And I know you want something quick. Something might, I mean, we can do whatever you direct us to do. But it does take a little time to do that.

Can you do both? Can you come back with a short term and still do the master plan? Because I think we need that master plan.

So what I'm hearing is there's a majority already that has an interest in a dog park. What we can do is we can carve that out and let us do a feasibility study for a dog park that would entail identifying all viable locations throughout the city and potential cost estimates and then bring it back to you.

You got it.

Could I request, if it's okay with you, that we start at Centennial? I mean, that that be the first one, and then we could move forward with the others?

Yes, we'll include that.

Okay, Councilor Solario. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Yeah, I think what makes sense is staff to come back with the feasibility on Centennial, the site that has been preferred in the past. Because, again, we should have multiple in large and small options, too. And then there was another interesting area, too, that I saw. they even gave me a satellite image. Near the lawn bowling center, there's one area where it's like the roof, but there's grass and dirt, and I think even police dogs used to train up there, and that might be another site as well, and Centennial may make a lot of sense as well.

Thank you. Mr. Mayor, would you please? Yes, Councilman Peña-Losa.

David PenalozaItem —

I just wanted to say that I also agree with Councilman Iglesias on that location at Centennial Park. I think it'd be because we also don't want just a little sliver just throughout the park you know if maybe away and I'm sure you guys will you know look around Orange County look at the different sizes that of parks that already dog parks that already exist in Orange County and see how close we can get to those because even the ones that already exist in Orange County they're not that big and and it just gets crowded with all. So I would like to focus on one central area where we could build a nice-size dog park,

David PenalozaItem —

and I agree with the Centennial Park location towards the back.

One more thought, if I may, before we leave the subject. There are other cities, Long Beach, for example, maybe it's a little more analogous to Santa Ana in terms of population and density and other things. Let's maybe, I know Hedarlo Moed is over there now. Let's go to Hedarlo and say, how many dog parks do you have? And what are you doing? And how big are they? And how far apart? And how do they work? Because I definitely want to start at Centennial. I think it's there. It's easy. But let's think about folks that are not going to be able to get to Centennial. And there might be pockets here and there where we can do something.

So if we can just think out of the box a little bit.

David PenalozaItem —

So with that, go ahead. Just really quick, I just feel that even because I do frequent the dog parks in Orange County a lot. With your dog, right? With my dog. Just clarification. Obviously.

David PenalozaItem —

And I do run into a lot of people that live in San Diego, and I feel like the people that would normally take their dogs to a dog park will make that effort and drive, because they're already driving to Irvine, to Laguna Canyon, to Costa Mesa. I think they will drive many of them. So that would be a, I don't think that's a big concern of mine is where, you know, how can people get to it. So you have to have parking. Right, yeah. And Centennial Park has a parking lot. So.

All right. So enough on that for now. I believe we did not take an action on a previous item, 60C. We had a motion and a second.

The motion was to just reaffirm Mayor Pro Tem Villegas for the remaining of the term. Those in favor, please press green.

Certainly.

Why was this even brought up for discussion?

That is a good question. However, I think it was placed on a previous agenda, and then it's still there. We don't have to take any action, I believe, and if it doesn't, if we don't take any action, it could die because we took no action in the previous vote that we had a year ago or whatever would prevail.

So, Madam City Attorney, why?

Is that correct, what I just said?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

Yes, Mayor, what you just said is correct.

So we don't have to take any action right now to answer your question. Why it was placed on the agenda, I don't know.

David PenalozaItem —

Madam State Attorney, do you want to just answer Councilman Iglesias' question?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

I think it would kind of require a joint answer, but the item was placed on the agenda after it was brought to the attention of the City Clerk. It was looked at, and in deference to the language in the Charter, it was placed on the agenda. I will say from a legal standpoint, it was mostly placed on the agenda because the city council, as I previously stated, has the ultimate discretion to decide who's going to serve as mayor pro tem. And that's why the item is before you. If the question was asked, it's before you. You can either stick with the action that you took a year ago in making a two-year appointment.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

You can decide to readdress that issue. It's completely within your discretion.

David PenalozaItem —

Madam city attorney, you made no mention of the city charter. That would be your appropriate answer for the question.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

That may be your answer to the question. That is not my answer to the question. So there is language in the city charter which says that after a special or general election, the city council shall select a mayor pro tem at their first regular meeting after the election. We did some historic research. We found that there has been one other special election, and in that case, the item of the Mayor Pro Tem was placed there. What you have to do is put it all in context.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

We went back and looked to the late 80s, I think early 90s, and the City Council has always, and has traditionally chosen, a Mayor Pro Tem every two years when it is organized. Why did they do that? Because there was a subsequent municipal code provision, a municipal code provision which I did not have an opportunity to discuss with some of you, so that's why I'm clarifying this issue, which states that the city council, after it elects council members, shall then, after it organizes, so it's when it reorganizes, shall select the mayor pro tem. We could spend all night talking about the terms of the charter.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

We could talk about the municipal code. But ultimately, council members, you get to choose who's going to serve as your mayor pro tem. When you do it and how you do it is completely up to you. So the item was placed on the agenda in a direct answer because of the language in the charter. That's why it is before you. But now it is solely within your discretion to decide what you're going to do with that.

Madam City, Madam. See, was that simple? Hold on. Please continue. I'm sorry.

David PenalozaItem —

Go ahead. See, the last sentence was a simple answer to a simple question, which you should have just said 10 minutes ago and avoided all that dialogue. But thank you, Madam City Attorney.

Okay, Mayor Pro Tem. There was also, I was elected unanimously by the council when we had all seven, and there was one member who had to resign, and that was the intent of this council to serve. It's been a tradition that we serve two years, always. It's always been that except for that one occasion. And just because we look at, you know, there's letter of the law and then there's spirit of the law. Am I correct? Okay. And so this is the spirit of the law. I know we had, we added one member to the council. If you want to hang your head on language in there, it says members and it says plural, not member. It says members.

So members would be two or more members joining the council. But the intention of the council when they gave the, you know, when they elected a mayor pro tem, here you go. And if you look at the report, it states there, it says from 2018 to 2020. And I was just hoping to continue to serve in this capacity because that was the intent of the council. But we have one gentleman who joined us now because the other one had to drop out. We want to start all over again. But, you know, it is what it is. I'm a big boy. We can take a vote if you want.

Those are my comments. Thank you for bringing it up.

Councilman Iglesias, you had the floor.

Yeah, so I'm just, I guess, lost for words. Because, you know, two years ago, this, two years, last year. God, it just seems forever.

One year, correct.

we elected council member viegas to serve but you were saying that because of the charter now we could bring it up for discussion so this would be the only time when it comes up for discussion

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

when someone is no and that's a point i'm trying to make you could bring it up at any time you don't need to have a general election or a special election to bring up the issue of the selection It's completely within the discretion of the city council. You have this charter provision which says when you have these elections, because most cities do that, you should get together and you should organize and decide who's going to serve as your mayor pro tem. But you don't need the charter provision in order to take that action. That's why at the end of the day, in consulting with the clerk, we decided that it would be

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

placed on the agenda for you to look at, but you don't have to put it there and you don't have to take action. And let me just make this comment because I think this is really important for the Council to consider. Your charter was adopted in the 1950s. This language is original language that was in that charter when you adopted it. If you literally want us, your appointees, to comply with the literal language of that charter, the next time when you have an election in 2020, the very first meeting after the election, we'll be asking you to select Mayor Pro Tem.

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

Even if members on this council will be termed out and never returning, we would be, we'd put it on the agenda for you to do that. I think from a common sense standpoint, that is not the spirit of the charter. And I think that's really important. But I want to get back to the original thing. You have the discretion to do it.

Okay. Councilor Peña-Losa, please.

David PenalozaItem —

And I think that's why, six months ago, I, 85 of the item to look at the charter and look at updates, which you guys still haven't. I don't know what's the status on that, why it takes so long to bring it back to us for discussion or potential ad hocs. And it just seems like staff, you know, the leadership, I don't, you know, why has it been six months? Every time I see you, oh, I'm working on it, but, you know, it's something that has been done multiple times. Please don't interrupt. Has been done multiple times, but we haven't seen it.

David PenalozaItem —

There's a lot of things in the charter that should be updated, should be looked at, should be taken to the voters of Santa Ana to clean up, to remove that outdated language. I understand what Mayor Potem Viega said. Yeah, traditionally, council members have served for two-year terms. I get that. But, you know, thankfully, we don't have a special election every six months because that would be chaos. And hopefully we don't have any soon. And that's why that was brought. because in the charter, it says that after a special election, you know, but traditionally, yeah, we only have elections every two years,

David PenalozaItem —

so that's why Council Members serve two-year terms for the most part. Mr. Mayor.

Hold on, hold on. I don't know if he's done.

David PenalozaItem —

Were you going to respond?

I was just going to mention that, Council Member, I did mention to you that I didn't want to pursue that until the seventh member was seated.

David PenalozaItem —

You never said that. You said that you were, you never said you were waiting for the seventh member, but thank you for letting me know. Mayor Pro Tem, then I've got a quick comment.

Here's an example for people that the audience or anyone out there who's thinking how this came about or how we're going to go about it.

You have the Constitution of the United States. You have the right to bear arms. But then it goes to court and they interpret your right to bear arms. And then you have state law and all these different things. Here the intent is for us to choose after they have an election of members, plural. But the intent of the council, when they voted, if you look at the report, it says there from what time to what time you're supposed to vote. And it is true that four members here can go on, come up here, and then bring the item up as an 85A, and they can choose a mayor pro tem. And it just depends which four are sticking together which week.

And the city needs stability. The intent of the council, the way it's written, the intent of it is for there to be a mayor, for there to be someone who's a mayor pro tem, and move forward. In two years, things change. All I'm asking is that we keep the tradition of the council and allow me to continue to serve. If you want to take a vote, we can take a vote. Mr. Mayor?

Yes, and I've got a comment. Go ahead, Council Member Becerra.

Phil BacerraItem —

I just want to respond to Council Member Paloza. I 1,000% agree. We need to shake the etch-a-sketch and get this charter updated, contemporized, modernized, however you want to phrase it. But I 1,000% agree, and now that the seventh member is here, I'm happy to join you, and let's get it done.

Phil BacerraItem —

That's it.

Let me, real quick, let me just say that I believe that portion of the charter, you can call it antiquated, but it isn't. It clearly states that any time we can take this up. And what the city attorney is telling us is you can do it and you can do it right after an election before people are seated, which I think would be silly. Because if you did that, then when you council members got sworn in, they'd say we want to take a vote now because we just got sworn in. So we just have to use our common sense a little bit here. That's all. And we're fine.

We can change it so it says you'll do it after a general election, when council members are seated. But at the end of the day, I don't think you want a charter that says you don't have a choice. I think it's best to let the council, at any moment of time, if whoever the mayor pro tem is, is not behaving to the pleasure of the rest of the council, the rest of the council should be able to say, I'm going to agendize it and vote on it. Period. I don't think we need a charter update or anything else to be able to do that. We have that power, and we should have that power. Mr. Mayor? Yes, go ahead.

David PenalozaItem —

That charter, that language with the Mayor Pro Tem wasn't even in my purview, and it still isn't as part of the charter update. There's just so much other stuff that really, that's not what I was referring to. Fair enough. But the city attorney did say the charter, there's a lot of language in there that's still from the 1950s. that needs to be looked at. Not the Mayor Pro Temp.

We should have that ability. Fair enough. No problem. Fair enough. So we are where we are right now. We have a motion and a second for Mayor Pro Temp Villegas. I suggest we take a vote. If it fails, then it's over. It's done with and we move on. And if somebody wants to agendize it again, we could agendize it at every meeting and vote on it over and over and over again. I think that is not a useful use of our time. Right now there's a motion to second for Juan from Mayor Putembe-Legas.

There would be no stability if that were to happen.

Well, and that's another argument. But right now you can vote yes, you can vote no. If there aren't four votes, then I think the issue just goes away because we all have taken an action and nothing happened. May I say something? Sure.

But for future, I think we should look at it. I know with the school board, every year they do restructuring of who's going to be the president, who's going to be the secretary, and who's going to be the vice president. But I think moving forward we should do that. But at this point, I mean, when we elected Juan to be here, he was under the understanding. But I think it's something that we should look into. Except for the council. Yeah.

David PenalozaItem —

I would support you. That's something that I thought about, that when you look regionally at most of the county, it's on an annual basis. Even the mayor. It's the mayor and the mayor pro-temp.

Well, direct elected mayor is different. It's different.

David PenalozaItem —

No, no, I know. I know. I know. All right, just clarifying. All right. You're taking it out of context. Yes, I agree.

But if that's something that you want to look into, I'll be with you.

Yeah, we're taking a vote right now just to keep it as is, basically. And then we move on and we go on to other issues.

He's not there.

All right. Motion carries. Now let's just move on. Is it the Housing Authority next, Madam Clerk? That's correct. Okay, I would entertain a motion on the Housing Authority. I would excuse Councilor Vince Sarmiento from not attending. is part of the motion. So I'll make the motion. There's a motion and a second. That's on item 1, 2,

and 3. There are no comments, so those in favor of item 1 and 2, please vote green. Council Member Solario is entering the room, so he did attend the housing authority, and we will wait for him to vote.

Iglesias, I think she voted already. Villegas voted twice.

You voted, right?

Who?

Got it.

Push it again. It's there. All right. And please note that Councilman Sarmiento was excused. So with that, we're coming to the end of a meeting here.

We have Tony Bui and Carl Benninger. Come on down.

Tony, you're up. Do you want to go first or do you want to go second?

Thank you, Carl, for the gracious act. Go ahead, please. Well, good evening, Mayor and City Council members. I've been waiting, spending 300 minutes to get three minutes to be here with you.

And I'm going to talk to you and meet with you. I know you already requested, so please continue.

I spent seven seconds so that all of we can breathe and be ourselves. Why seven? because in the past seven months one of the members of Santa Ana resident distinguished monk named Thich Quang Thanh he's the the man who created the temple if you drive on New Hope north you will see a beautiful magnificent

landmark of Santa Ana. And he had been recognized with a plaque for his landmark. He had collected millions of dollars just to bring into the city of Santa Ana and make the city of Santa Ana beautiful in that area and it may be considered a lung of Santa Ana City or a liver of Santa Ana City and he had spent all his effort to create a temple which

now belong to not only to the members of the so-called Vietnamese American Center for charitable service, Bảo Quang Temple, but it belonged to all residents of St. Anna. So now we have problems that mean because he dedicated most of his talent for the hardware, cement, and brick, now he forgot to implement, not forgot. He will make, implement on the things that he had in here. For example, section two, he planned to get the

election the board directors. However, he passed away that is seven months ago. That's why I dedicate seven seconds for his contribution to the city of Santa Anna and I hereby ask your help to come and visit the temple and help us with the reorganize or re helping so that this Santa Ana property will not fall into the hand of other people which which will be disowned and be very bad

for the city of Santa Ana so please come to this to the temple on December 15 so we will have the register to vote for all members and by November by January 5th we will go to have general meeting to do to elect 20 boards of member to make sure that the temple belongs not only to the members but also to all

residents of Santa Ana. That is my request here. Please come and help us by provide us a legal system. Thank you very much.

Tony, thank you. The light is red but let me say this and may the City Attorney could look into this a tad. The master that built this died seven months ago. I know if other council members went or not, but I went to say goodbye to him. I saw you. I remember when he prayed. And he prayed.

To you and to all of you had contributed your help to make the temple established.

And I have tremendous respect for him. but I just want to understand and that's why I want the city attorney to look at it briefly, Tony, as to what we can do because as I understand it, there's the nephew or somebody that's here from Vietnam, he's kind of taken over. No, don't say take over. He will be appointed

as an expert. However, there is two members that the master assigns them to be treasurer and secretary. They consider themselves as director. That is why we have conflicting...

I just don't want to misrepresent anything. I don't know what exactly we can do. I see this as an internal power struggle over the control of the beautiful temple that the master built. If he were alive today, we wouldn't be talking. He had his vision, he had his followers, he had the whole thing. Right now he's left and it is chaos.

Yes, I need your advising or at least suggest some legal, public legal advisor.

So maybe briefly before the 15th, if staff could look at it briefly, maybe we can give you advice, maybe we can attend things, maybe we can give you our blessings. I just know that I think it's limited

as to what we can officially do. Because this does not belong to the members, but belong to St. Anna's residents and the property of St. Anna, too.

And it's a blessing to the entire city that that temple is there. Thank you, Tony. Thank you very much. We'll talk more. Carl, come on up, sir.

Thank you. Thank you for your concern.

Thank you, Tony.

It's been a long night. I'll keep this simple. It was announced yesterday that Mr. Pat Murphy will be leaving Mater Dei High School to become the president, head of operations of the Arizona Coyote National Hockey League team in Phoenix. What I would really ask the council to do, and maybe Mayor, you'd like to do this. I think we should honor Mr. Murphy. We've already invited him. Oh, you are ahead of me.

Yes.

Thank you. That was my main point, and thank you very much. He does deserve it. Just walk around the campus and see the many good things he's done for the school, which is a great reflection on that.

Patrick's a wonderful man, and he was there, I think, for 30 years, and he's going to be sorely missed. I hope it doesn't get too hot for him out there in the desert. Maybe he's going to retire there eventually. I'm not sure what is going on, but, yeah, I've already invited him. He's trying to find a time that he can come here to the council so we can properly recognize him, Carl. I appreciate that. I will also tell you that Steve Salat is going to be taking over as president. He also has a lot of Santa Ana roots. He was a priest here for many years, and I'm sure he's going to be wonderful heading up Mater Dei.

He's a graduate of Mater Dei in 1972.

Really?

Yes.

Did you go to Mater Dei?

No, I did. Two of my children did, so I do own a brick over there. I paid for tuition, but no, he's a graduate of 1972.

Good for you, Carl. It's a wonderful institution, and we thank you for coming down and telling us that.

I just want to close you. Juan, we definitely support you. You're doing an excellent job.

Thank you, sir. Thank you very much.

As Mayor Pro Tem or in general? I'm just kidding. Trying to make a joke. But anyway, sometimes people don't laugh. I think we're coming towards the end of the meeting.

City Clerk says that's correct. So why don't we take a city manager's report?

Just two quick items, Mayor. On Saturday, December 7th, the Santa Ana Police Department is collaborating with the Loaded Cafe for their annual Pancakes with Santa. This event will take place at the Santa Ana Police Department from 8 a.m. to 10 a.m. And they're going to have a lot of family-friendly events, so we welcome everybody out to that. And then on Saturday, December 14th, we're excited to unveil the new Mariposa Park and the Jerome Park Fitness Zone with two ribbon-cutting ceremonies. That's all.

Thank you. Why don't we start with Council Member Solario, please?

Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I'm just here very quickly wanting to find the date of a fantastic new event that's coming to Santa Ana. It's called Downtown Santa Ana Tamale Fest 2019. Eddie Quiades and the Kiwanis and others are putting that together, and that seems like a fabulous idea. Again, that's Thursday, December 19th. 5 p.m. to 10 p.m. And you can look it up on Facebook and get more information.

Is there a specific address?

It says West 4th Street will be closed for the event.

All right, so maybe it's multiple.

Yeah.

All right, just trying to let folks at home know. Thank you. Keep going, please. That's all. That's it?

I wanted to wish everybody happy holidays, but I think we have another meeting be between now and then so i'll see those comments till their christmas for that yes thank you

David PenalozaItem —

counselor david peña losa please thank you mr mayor um just wanted to hope everyone had a nice holiday with their families and wanted uh um madam city manager uh tomorrow there's a there's a uh thornton park neighborhood association meeting i already spoke to to nabid mr nabil about it I'd like to possibly have some of the water guys there to give an update on that water increase,

David PenalozaItem —

which I voted no on, and the pipe construction that's been going on for months in that neighborhood. there's been just we've sent emails back and forth this week about just what what the status is and why it's taking so long so I looked at the agenda for the Thorin Park neighborhood Association and I didn't see any of that as an update scheduled for tomorrow's agenda so that'd be good to be out there just to give those those residents an update I just wanted to and that was it actually

David PenalozaItem —

And with the water increases, you know, not sure if we had, when is the meeting scheduled in Floral Park? That we were going to, is that already happened? Is that going to happen?

Sir, I don't have a date, but I know that their president had requested it.

David PenalozaItem —

Okay, let's just make sure, just a reminder, let's make sure that we reach out to all the neighborhood associations across the city and possibly have a space available to make sure that that information is, everybody receives it. Thank you, and that's it.

Thank you for that, Council Member. Council Member Iglesias, please.

Okay.

I have a few questions for the city manager and for the city attorney. As you all know, the County of Orange, they voted on the homeless shelter, the Yale, I think it was at their last meeting, the supervisors meeting. I attended as a resident of Ward 6 and also as a council member, not speaking on behalf of the council, but just myself as a council member. And they're moving forward with the Yale location. They still haven't included any of us here in the conversations on how they're going to operate the facility.

We had also the school board president, Valerie Mesquah, and also John Palacio, who's one of the members, also speak in opposition for this site. And one of the things that I am asking is, what is the possibility of doing a referendum for no more homeless shelters, especially county homeless shelters here in the city of Santa Ana? What is the process and what does it take?

I don't know if it's a referendum or it would be an initiative. I mean, either or. So what would it be?

So I'll speak in layman terms and certainly then turn it over to the city attorney. There would actually have to be an action that you were doing a referendum against, and only certain actions are entitled to go through a referendum process. So I don't believe there have been any actions taken that would be subject to that process.

So that would mean putting it on the agenda for us to take an action? Or what do you mean?

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

When you talk about a referendum, you can only have a referendum when there's a legislative act, and a legislative act is either taken by resolution, for example, or adoption of an ordinance. And I think what the city manager is saying is the county has not adopted any resolutions or ordinances that are legislative acts that would then give you the ability to do a referendum.

So bottom line is we can't stop the Yale Shelter from opening.

No.

I can't answer that question. I know the county has backed away from shelters before due to community input, but I can't speak on behalf of the county. Okay, go ahead.

David PenalozaItem —

I think what she's trying to ask is what would it take for us, the City Council, to send the measure to the voters to say, Santa Ana has done enough county, we're trying to block this shelter, this Yolcite shelter from opening, not a referendum because it wasn't an action that we did, but just as a ballot initiative. From what I understand, Councilwoman Iglesias? Okay.

Phil BacerraItem —

And what about SB2?

So the County of Orange is not subject. They have jurisdictional authority within the entire County of Orange, so they do not have to comply with our SB2 or go through our permitting process for that matter.

Phil BacerraItem —

I'm sorry, not to interrupt, but what I meant by SB2 was the fact that I don't think we can just ban shelters. Like, in other words, there's state. But no, I believe you're absolutely correct about county jurisdiction, right?

No, Council Member, you're correct. The state requires all cities to identify an area in their city where they would permit homeless shelters by right. They certainly can limit the number of beds. Going back to my question, if I may.

But my understanding SB2 is for 200 beds, right? I think that's the maximum. So they're doing 425.

I believe your SB2 did provide for one 200-bed homeless shelter. but once again the county is not obligated to follow your SB 2 zones what

Sonia R. CarvalhoItem —

I would tell you is this I think I understand what your questions are I think what you're really looking for is legal advice on what your options are and I think that we can get you that information but there because there are some legal issues that we need to discuss and I know that we are scheduling some time we also have a pending case under pending litigation so that we can

get you responses to that so that'll be something they bring back in closed session something we can talk about but it's something i believe we need to send a message to the county that enough is enough and that you know that i know i'm talking about it council member peniello says too that we know we we can't be the dumping ground anymore for the county with especially with with what they're doing to us um with uh with the homeless so my other question is um on on the homeless there's i know we have the link right now and we're looking i

I guess, you know, under, and I don't know if this is something that is confidential, that, you know, we have to move from the link location. So how we identified other locations that where we're thinking of putting our shelter from the city of Santa Ana. So I would like more information on that.

Okay. And you're correct. In our settlement agreement under the litigation with the Catholic workers, we are to provide a 200-bed facility up to scalability to 250. and it has to have a short overlap with the link. So we are in the process of doing an RFP to solicit responses for a private-public partnership, whether it's a purchase of a building, a lease of a building, an operator, tenant improvements included in it, and we'll be prepared to issue that in the near future. And then once that is out, we'll get the responses to it, and then we will present to you where all the locations are that are potential for it.

I don't have any locations in mind.

Okay.

So that'll be it. I'm hoping that as a council that we step up and we tell the county no more because I think they've just been taking us for granted, and we just stay quiet, and I think it's time for – we have done it, but I think uniformly we should step up and say no more.

Thank you. Councilor LeCera, please.

Phil BacerraItem —

Thank you, Mr. Mayor. And Councilmember Iglesias, I appreciate you saying what you just said because I agree. and I'd like to ask the city manager to agendize a discussion on how we're going to proceed with the homeless on the next closed session agenda. I don't want to completely echo everything Council Member Iglesias said, but yes, enough's enough. And thank you, Council Member Iglesias, for taking the time to attend the Board of Supes meeting. But I don't think you or any one of us should have to go lone wolf and have to speak on behalf of residents.

Phil BacerraItem —

I think we, as an elected council, should be sticking up for our residents, provide a united front. We've got able-bodied staff. Let's give them hell. So let's go out there. Let's defend our city. We've done our part. You look at the northern spa, the service area, you have multiple cities doing 200-bed shelters. We have a 200-bed shelter, and yes, per the settlement, we're going to transition to another facility that will have at least 2 to 250 beds. But to have this additional 400 or 600 beds is completely nonsense. There are other cities in the central spot where we're located that aren't doing that.

Phil BacerraItem —

And then on top of that, you have 10 cities in South Orange County that have zero shelter beds. So with all due respect, I would like to ask staff to be ready for a discussion at our next council meeting in closed session so that we can all get on the same page and move forward aggressively. Thank you.

Thank you. Mayor Pro Tem.

Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I want to thank my colleagues who voted for me to continue to serve my term as Mayor Pro Tem. I want to continue to bring honor to the position. I'm not a perfect man, but then again, who is? I definitely try. This business is tough. If people would only know all the stuff that's going on in the background, orchestrated hits, such and such, et cetera, et cetera. and yet I try to remain focused on the work and other than God and my family

which are my main priorities in life everyone that knows me that when I work here at the council which I try to come just about every day every morning I'm here at City Hall just about I I look out for my employees and I look out for the residents The city needs to move forward. I know there's a lot of promises that have been made. Sometimes it's tough. People, the public will say, hey, you said this and you said that, but we're just one person of seven up here. You need four to move forward. And that also needs to be legal.

And it needs to be within policy or creative policy or the charter or what have you. And also it needs to be the right thing. it's very very difficult you know sometimes to uh to stand alone and many of you that know me know that i've stood alone many times on many issues and i give it a lot of thought but it's always with my intention of making sure i try to do what's right in my mind and in my heart for this city so thank you everyone and thank you mr mayor i appreciate it for the uh you're welcome uh just

to everybody. Look, we're all working hard. We all love the city. Let's keep up the good work. I think we're coming towards the end of the year. Pretty soon we're going to be talking about Christmas and the new year, and then we'll go hopefully into a better and stronger 2020. I know the city manager, you take a lot of things that come your way. You still haven't been here that long. How many months has it been now?

See, you're seven months going on E. So give her a little bit more time. We keep adjusting things. I think we're going to have a great 2020. So with that let's go home. It's not as late as it's been other nights but it's not bad. It's not bad.

I'll see you next time.

Thank you.